Author Topic: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-23 : S/N 1021) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage  (Read 85786 times)

Offline Chris Bergin

New thread to cover the F9 S1 at KSC and the reuse testing (up to ten static fires).

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To get our ducks in a row (pun intended):

CRS-8 Related News Articles:
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/?s=CRS-8

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Falcon 9 S1 ASDS Return and Port Canaveral Processing:
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=40002.0

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Resources:

SpaceX News Articles from 2006 (Including numerous exclusive Elon interviews):
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=21862.0

SpaceX News Articles (Recent):
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/tag/spacex/

SpaceX ASDS Articles:
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/?s=ASDS
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/tag/asds/

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Pre-Launch:
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2016/03/spacex-prepares-two-missions-mcgregor/

Static Fire:
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2016/04/spacex-falcon-9-static-fire-crs-8-mission/

Main Launch Article:
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2016/04/spacex-dragon-rtf-falcon9-launch/

ASDS Return To Port Article:
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2016/04/falcon-9-first-stage-port-canaveral-asds-big-plans/

End of Port Canaveral Processing Article:
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2016/04/falcon-9-booster-reuse-testing-ksc/

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L2 SpaceX Section:
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=24469.0

L2 CRS-8 Section:
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=39521.0

L2 SpaceX F9-0023-S1 Post-Landing KSC Testing Updates:
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=40085.0

Offline sevenperforce

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #1 on: 04/19/2016 01:58 PM »
Is the static fire pad visible from any publicly accessible area?

Do they stand the Falcon up for static fires or are those done horizontally?

Offline Brick_top

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #2 on: 04/19/2016 02:10 PM »
hope everything goes well! Good luck to all of us  ;D 8)

Offline the_other_Doug

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #3 on: 04/19/2016 02:24 PM »
Is the static fire pad visible from any publicly accessible area?

Do they stand the Falcon up for static fires or are those done horizontally?

Since they will be (they say) doing the static fires on this stage at LC-39A, then yeah, I think that pad is visible from publicly accessible areas.  ;)

And yes, they stand it upright on the launch pad before firing it.  I may be mistaken, but I don't believe these stages are ever static-fired from a horizontal position.
-Doug  (With my shield, not yet upon it)

Offline rocx

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #4 on: 04/19/2016 02:35 PM »
Is the static fire pad visible from any publicly accessible area?

Do they stand the Falcon up for static fires or are those done horizontally?

Since they will be (they say) doing the static fires on this stage at LC-39A, then yeah, I think that pad is visible from publicly accessible areas.  ;)

And yes, they stand it upright on the launch pad before firing it.  I may be mistaken, but I don't believe these stages are ever static-fired from a horizontal position.

No Falcon stages, maybe no liquid fuel stages at all, but solid boosters have been tested horizontally:
Any day with a rocket landing is a fantastic day.

Offline Chris Bergin

Remember, this one is going to be a long process, so keep the posts useful. This isn't a party thread ;)

Article to where we are:
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2016/04/falcon-9-booster-reuse-testing-ksc/

Offline Bubbinski

I think the Saturn V Center is probably one of the better publicly accessible areas to see Pad 39A and the upcoming test firing/activity. I don't know if the KSCVC buses stop anymore at the observation tower with the SSME in it that I saw Atlantis from in 2007 before STS-117.
I'll even excitedly look forward to "flags and footprints" and suborbital missions. Just fly...somewhere.

Offline mvpel

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #7 on: 04/19/2016 07:48 PM »
I think the Saturn V Center is probably one of the better publicly accessible areas to see Pad 39A and the upcoming test firing/activity. I don't know if the KSCVC buses stop anymore at the observation tower with the SSME in it that I saw Atlantis from in 2007 before STS-117.
That SSME is gone - I was wondering what the big hole was for. They now sell tickets for launch viewing at that location as "LC39 Gantry" for $50 plus general admission.

This is the view to LC-40 from there:

Untitled
by Michael Pelletier, on Flickr
« Last Edit: 04/19/2016 07:48 PM by mvpel »
"Ugly programs are like ugly suspension bridges: they're much more liable to collapse than pretty ones, because the way humans (especially engineer-humans) perceive beauty is intimately related to our ability to process and understand complexity. A language that makes it hard to write elegant code makes it hard to write good code." - Eric S. Raymond

Offline x15_fan

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #8 on: 04/19/2016 09:12 PM »
Does anyone have any idea of the damage to the thermal blanket skirt here was also seen on Orbcomm-2 mission? I wonder how bad this will end up?

http://i.imgur.com/hu1pc43.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/LXCYvB7.jpg

Online spacenut

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #9 on: 04/20/2016 12:34 AM »
ROCX, I don't think the Falcon 9 can be tested horizontally because it is a liquid fueled rocket.  Once it launches the g force can keep the liquid pushing down along with pressurized helium, even if it turns horizontal.  Once in orbit in zero g, the 2nd stage fuel under pressure should stay in place.  It doesn't matter with solids, with or without gravity.  So, I think they used the rocket tie-downs on the launch pad for testing, only releasing when there is an actual launch.  Same at McGregor, Texas. 

Offline S.Paulissen

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #10 on: 04/20/2016 12:49 AM »
ROCX, I don't think the Falcon 9 can be tested horizontally because it is a liquid fueled rocket.  Once it launches the g force can keep the liquid pushing down along with pressurized helium, even if it turns horizontal.  Once in orbit in zero g, the 2nd stage fuel under pressure should stay in place.  It doesn't matter with solids, with or without gravity.  So, I think they used the rocket tie-downs on the launch pad for testing, only releasing when there is an actual launch.  Same at McGregor, Texas.

This part is incorrect.

http://imgur.com/gallery/WgqveaA
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Offline Danny452

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #11 on: 04/20/2016 12:55 AM »
Why 10 static fires?  After the first static fire, what is the purpose of the remaining 9?  Have other stages been subject to 10 static fires?

Offline QuantumG

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #12 on: 04/20/2016 12:59 AM »
No idea. They're aiming for 10 reuses of the stage. I guess they feel 10 static tests is a good indicator of that sort of reliability.
Jeff Bezos has billions to spend on rockets and can go at whatever pace he likes! Wow! What pace is he going at? Well... have you heard of Zeno's paradox?

Offline darkenfast

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #13 on: 04/20/2016 01:02 AM »
Musk said that that is about how many times they will re-fire it.  I think it's to demonstrate the robustness of the design and to build up experience and data.  If they do this and then successfully launch the rocket with a paying customer that will send a very strong message to the whole industry.

Offline jabe

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #14 on: 04/20/2016 01:02 AM »
my WAG... start up takes a toll on the engine..and since I doubt they can do a full duration test fire at the launch pad this is a good replacement of abuse.. could be WAY off!!
jb

Offline S.Paulissen

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #15 on: 04/20/2016 01:07 AM »
That is a good question.   It's not abundantly clear from Elon's off the cuff "We thought we'd test fire it 10 times and consider it good for relaunch." 

 I'm thinking it's more that they've got a shiny sooty new toy and it's now a 'free' core for them to play out their engineering fantasies (hopefully realities) of 100 launches with the same booster.  So they're going to go ahead and hit it with 10 full duration burns to validate their ideas of the wear on the engine and then relaunch it.  I can see how they'd think that a payload owner might be impressed with 10 consecutive successful static fires with all associated thermal cycles of tanking and burns and agree to launch their payload at less of a discount.
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Offline QuantumG

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #16 on: 04/20/2016 01:28 AM »
Elon did say "we're a bit like the dog that caught the bus".
Jeff Bezos has billions to spend on rockets and can go at whatever pace he likes! Wow! What pace is he going at? Well... have you heard of Zeno's paradox?

Offline Navier–Stokes

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #17 on: 04/20/2016 01:51 AM »
Elon just tweeted the attached picture of ORBCOMM-2 and CRS-8 side-by-side in 39A's HIF:
Quote
Elon Musk ‏@elonmusk 6:30 PM - 19 Apr 2016
By land and sea
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/722598287396605953

Looks like ORBCOMM-2 has undergone some additional inspections post-static fire as five of the engines are missing.
« Last Edit: 04/20/2016 01:53 AM by Navier–Stokes »

Offline Jim

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #18 on: 04/20/2016 01:55 AM »
ROCX, I don't think the Falcon 9 can be tested horizontally because it is a liquid fueled rocket.  Once it launches the g force can keep the liquid pushing down along with pressurized helium, even if it turns horizontal.  Once in orbit in zero g, the 2nd stage fuel under pressure should stay in place.  It doesn't matter with solids, with or without gravity.  So, I think they used the rocket tie-downs on the launch pad for testing, only releasing when there is an actual launch.  Same at McGregor, Texas.

This part is incorrect.


Here is the correction.

Once in orbit in zero g, the 2nd stage fuel under low thrust * should stay in place.

* provided by thrusters before re-ignition.

Offline Coastal Ron

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Re: SpaceX Falcon 9 (F9-S1-0023) KSC Reuse Testing Coverage
« Reply #19 on: 04/20/2016 02:10 AM »
Elon just tweeted the attached picture of ORBCOMM-2 and CRS-8 side-by-side in 39A's HIF:
...
Looks like ORBCOMM-2 has undergone some additional inspections post-static fire as five of the engines are missing.

With the engines removed it easier to see the "cells" each engine sits in, which helps to protect neighbor engines if something goes boom...
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

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