Author Topic: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch  (Read 18474 times)

Offline Burninate

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1129
  • Liked: 343
  • Likes Given: 72
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #20 on: 10/16/2014 09:36 PM »
What I'd really love to see come out of this is a more VIABLE Stratolaunch LV design coupled with the smaller DC design but I'm seriously doubting that's going to happen.

Randy

What's more viable?

Offline RanulfC

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4416
  • Heus tu Omnis! Vigilate Hoc!
  • Liked: 770
  • Likes Given: 32
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #21 on: 10/16/2014 10:10 PM »
What I'd really love to see come out of this is a more VIABLE Stratolaunch LV design coupled with the smaller DC design but I'm seriously doubting that's going to happen.

What's more viable?

Probably should have been more "affordable" or "efficent" rather than viable :)

Randy
From The Amazing Catstronaut on the Black Arrow LV:
British physics, old chap. It's undignified to belch flames and effluvia all over the pad, what. A true gentlemen's orbital conveyance lifts itself into the air unostentatiously, with the minimum of spectacle and a modicum of grace. Not like our American cousins' launch vehicles, eh?

Offline rusty

  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 191
  • Liked: 14
  • Likes Given: 18
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #22 on: 10/22/2014 07:08 AM »
Let me know if this sounds familiar;
TSTO lifting body launches with booster from a mother ship, carrying two or three to orbit. If you guessed a mini-Dream Chaser, you'd be correct.


If it was thirty some-odd years ago, a small turbojet for powered landings and variable wings for subsonic flight were added, you'd probably guess SPIRAL. This design first flew - flown, not glided - as the Mig-105 and later the suborbital BOR testbeds with revised wings.
« Last Edit: 10/22/2014 07:10 AM by rusty »

Offline RanulfC

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4416
  • Heus tu Omnis! Vigilate Hoc!
  • Liked: 770
  • Likes Given: 32
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #23 on: 10/22/2014 04:35 PM »
Let me know if this sounds familiar;
TSTO lifting body launches with booster from a mother ship, carrying two or three to orbit. If you guessed a mini-Dream Chaser, you'd be correct.


If it was thirty some-odd years ago, a small turbojet for powered landings and variable wings for subsonic flight were added, you'd probably guess SPIRAL. This design first flew - flown, not glided - as the Mig-105 and later the suborbital BOR testbeds with revised wings.


Just to be technical, the SPIRAL had a hypersonic air-breathing stage, (staged at Mach-6) followed by a two-stage rocket powered stage and the Mig. Mini-DC has a subsonic air-breathing stage with a THREE stage rocket then the mini-DC. Also the Mig carried only one (1) person (in an escape capsule no less) while the mini-DC is supposed to carry "three people and some small cargo" to LEO.

IIRC didn't someone point out that part of the inspiration for the DC itself was the Mig/BOR? :)

Randy
From The Amazing Catstronaut on the Black Arrow LV:
British physics, old chap. It's undignified to belch flames and effluvia all over the pad, what. A true gentlemen's orbital conveyance lifts itself into the air unostentatiously, with the minimum of spectacle and a modicum of grace. Not like our American cousins' launch vehicles, eh?

Offline Prober

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10313
  • Save the spin....I'm keeping you honest!
  • Nevada
  • Liked: 700
  • Likes Given: 728
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #24 on: 10/22/2014 04:50 PM »
Dragon Slayer :D

3-passengers versus 7 and something like twice the cost? Not seeing that as a viable name :)

Randy

3-4 passengers might have been a more viable spacecraft. 8)
2017 - Everything Old is New Again.
I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work. ~ by Thomas Alva Edison

Offline RanulfC

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4416
  • Heus tu Omnis! Vigilate Hoc!
  • Liked: 770
  • Likes Given: 32
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #25 on: 10/22/2014 05:23 PM »
Dragon Slayer :D

3-passengers versus 7 and something like twice the cost? Not seeing that as a viable name :)

3-4 passengers might have been a more viable spacecraft. 8)

Actually agree with that but everything is pretty much in place for the 7-passenger Dragon V2 where it isn't for the 3-4 passenger Mini-DC :)

Not that I think they have any way to do it but frankly I see the Mini-DC concept being less adaptive to the StratoLauncher and more in need of something like the ALTO/CRoSSBoW. Mini-DC has everything needed to control everything from Take Off to Launch through Landing if coupled with a more efficent LV and remote controlled Aircraft system. On the other hand this is really one of the few viable ways I see of keeping the DC alive :)

Randy
From The Amazing Catstronaut on the Black Arrow LV:
British physics, old chap. It's undignified to belch flames and effluvia all over the pad, what. A true gentlemen's orbital conveyance lifts itself into the air unostentatiously, with the minimum of spectacle and a modicum of grace. Not like our American cousins' launch vehicles, eh?

Offline SirThoreth

  • Member
  • Member
  • Posts: 52
  • San Diego, CA
  • Liked: 1
  • Likes Given: 4
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #26 on: 11/12/2014 10:01 PM »
Rather than it be called a "smaller" Dream Chaser. It should be the sports version or the coupe.

Dream Chaser Superleggera.  Should appeal to the ESA that way, too. :)

Quote
Also (looking for the silver lining) the fact that it carry's half the passengers could be seen as a good thing. As,   compared to the "standard" Dream Chaser launched on a Atlas 5, The Dream Chaser coupe doubles the flight rate.

Once you've got the Stratolaunch it make sense to use it as often as possible.

My question, and it's not entirely addressed in the original article, is what they see as the expected mission/customer for the DC Superleggera, though.  Would ISS still be an option?  Standalone flights?

Offline yg1968

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9068
  • Liked: 1113
  • Likes Given: 757
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #27 on: 11/13/2014 01:07 PM »
For the record, Stratolaunch and SNC actually call it the scaled Dream Chaser.

Offline yg1968

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9068
  • Liked: 1113
  • Likes Given: 757
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #28 on: 11/13/2014 01:12 PM »
See post below:

This isn't a new article but it has some encourging quotes on the chances that Paul Allen will choose DC as its spacecraft.

Quote
“The whole point of Stratolaunch is to open up and really allow a fuller exploitation (of space) commercially,” said Stratolaunch executive director Charles Beames. The Dream Chaser is something like a “space Corvette,” he added. “It has Paul’s attention. He’s very excited about it.” Allen is expected to make a decision about whether to partner with Sierra Nevada before the end of the year, Beames added.

http://sen.com/news/paul-allen-s-stratolaunch-eyes-sierra-nevada-dream-chaser-space-plane

Offline grakenverb

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 430
  • New York
  • Liked: 27
  • Likes Given: 25
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #29 on: 11/13/2014 01:27 PM »
See post below:

This isn't a new article but it has some encourging quotes on the chances that Paul Allen will choose DC as its spacecraft.

Quote
“The whole point of Stratolaunch is to open up and really allow a fuller exploitation (of space) commercially,” said Stratolaunch executive director Charles Beames. The Dream Chaser is something like a “space Corvette,” he added. “It has Paul’s attention. He’s very excited about it.” Allen is expected to make a decision about whether to partner with Sierra Nevada before the end of the year, Beames added.

http://sen.com/news/paul-allen-s-stratolaunch-eyes-sierra-nevada-dream-chaser-space-plane

From the article:

"Stratolaunch’s Dream Chaser would be about 75 percent smaller, with seating for a pilot and up to two passengers, or a combination of passengers and crew."

75 percent smaller, wow, that is going to be one tiny spaceship.  ;D

Offline Rocket Science

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7840
  • NASA Educator Astronaut Candidate Applicant 2002
  • Liked: 2109
  • Likes Given: 4964
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #30 on: 11/13/2014 06:44 PM »
See post below:

This isn't a new article but it has some encourging quotes on the chances that Paul Allen will choose DC as its spacecraft.

Quote
“The whole point of Stratolaunch is to open up and really allow a fuller exploitation (of space) commercially,” said Stratolaunch executive director Charles Beames. The Dream Chaser is something like a “space Corvette,” he added. “It has Paul’s attention. He’s very excited about it.” Allen is expected to make a decision about whether to partner with Sierra Nevada before the end of the year, Beames added.

http://sen.com/news/paul-allen-s-stratolaunch-eyes-sierra-nevada-dream-chaser-space-plane

From the article:

"Stratolaunch’s Dream Chaser would be about 75 percent smaller, with seating for a pilot and up to two passengers, or a combination of passengers and crew."

75 percent smaller, wow, that is going to be one tiny spaceship.  ;D
Yeah, the astro-mice on board the ISS will test fly the mini-DC upon return... ;D
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob, Physics instructor, aviator, vintage auto racer

Offline Kaputnik

  • Extreme Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2768
  • Liked: 430
  • Likes Given: 364
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #31 on: 11/26/2014 09:49 PM »
Speculation: could scaled DC use a miniature docking system, requiring the ISS to host an adapter?
Waiting for joy and raptor

Offline Bob Shaw

  • Full Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 959
  • Liked: 356
  • Likes Given: 334
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #32 on: 11/26/2014 10:05 PM »

IIRC didn't someone point out that part of the inspiration for the DC itself was the Mig/BOR? :)

Randy

"Inspiration" is hardly the word for it, it's NASA's revenge for Buran!

Offline robertross

  • Canadian Member
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17772
  • Westphal, Nova Scotia
  • Liked: 440
  • Likes Given: 3278
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #33 on: 11/27/2014 01:47 AM »
Speculation: could scaled DC use a miniature docking system, requiring the ISS to host an adapter?

Then it would essentially be dedicated to DC. Also, it is something would have to be brought up on another vehicle.

Lots of added cost for an adpator to a station that many partner nations seem to be disinterested in now due to the recurring costs and limited national budgets. It's a rather sad situation.
Remembering those who made the ultimate sacrifice for our rights & freedoms, and for those injured, visible or otherwise, in that fight.

Offline ChrisWilson68

  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3521
  • Sunnyvale, CA
  • Liked: 2076
  • Likes Given: 2417
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #34 on: 11/27/2014 02:00 AM »
Speculation: could scaled DC use a miniature docking system, requiring the ISS to host an adapter?

Then it would essentially be dedicated to DC. Also, it is something would have to be brought up on another vehicle.

Lots of added cost for an adpator to a station that many partner nations seem to be disinterested in now due to the recurring costs and limited national budgets. It's a rather sad situation.

Lets not forget that NASA already had a chance to pick Dream Chaser but turned it down.  NASA has chosen two other commercial crew providers whose development they are funding, plus Russia has their own vehicle they will continue to use.  How many different crew vehicles are really needed to service a single station?

It's really grasping at straws to suggest mini-DC for ISS missions.  The fact that Orbital and Stratolaunch talk about it so much with respect to mini-DC just highlights the fact: mini-DC has no customers.  Even if Paul Allen decides to fund its development, after it's built, it will still have no customers.

The problem isn't that we lack crew vehicles for getting between the surface of the Earth and LEO.  We'll soon have many of them.  The problem is we have very little for them to do.  Lets work on that and stop wasting time and effort on yet another crew transfer system.

Online A_M_Swallow

  • Elite Veteran
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8154
  • South coast of England
  • Liked: 249
  • Likes Given: 104
Re: Smaller Dream Chaser for Stratolaunch
« Reply #35 on: 11/27/2014 03:46 AM »
Speculation: could scaled DC use a miniature docking system, requiring the ISS to host an adapter?

Then it would essentially be dedicated to DC. Also, it is something would have to be brought up on another vehicle.

Lots of added cost for an adpator to a station that many partner nations seem to be disinterested in now due to the recurring costs and limited national budgets. It's a rather sad situation.

Miniature docking system - could the Dream Chase dock using a suit port?
Possibly fitted sideways.

Tags: