Author Topic: Future photoreconnaissance and other Russian military satellites  (Read 171033 times)

Offline Phillip Clark

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At present the Russian photoreconnaissance satellite programme appears to be totally reliant on the annual Kobalt-M missions - lasting 3-4 months - and presumably images from Resurs-DK (1).

We had the maiden launch of Persona in 2008 (as Cosmos 2441), but that satellite is reported to have malfunctioned in early 2009.   Is there any news of future Persona launches or even any other new classes of photoreconnaissance satellites appearing?
« Last Edit: 04/22/2015 07:12 pm by input~2 »
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Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #1 on: 12/25/2011 10:50 pm »
I am just re-iterating this query.

Is there news of a second Persona launch being scheduled or maybe the failure on the maiden flight has led to the programme being terminated?

Is there anything official or even rumoured about this, please?
I've always been crazy but it's kept me from going insane - WJ.

Offline pm1823

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #2 on: 12/26/2011 08:58 am »
Rumors are that second Persona's optics and some other parts was cаnibalized for Resurs-P.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #3 on: 12/27/2011 12:40 pm »
Rumors are that second Persona's optics and some other parts was cаnibalized for Resurs-P.

No need to hold my breath for something new coming along in the actual photoreconnaissance programme then.

Still, Resurs-P/PM could be interesting.
I've always been crazy but it's kept me from going insane - WJ.

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #4 on: 01/02/2012 07:50 am »
Google can find things; but not provide context

What do you make of this?

http://ssu.samara.ru/files/information/report2011/p4_08.rtf
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Проведение измерений передаваемой мощности на тепловых трубах 14Ф137 8974-0, 8975-0, 8961-0, 8962-0, 8963-0 в сотаве испытаний на функционирование в нормальных климатических условиях (ПСИ) для изделия 14Ф137 с №3

Offline ChileVerde

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #5 on: 01/02/2012 02:06 pm »
Google can find things; but not provide context

What do you make of this?

http://ssu.samara.ru/files/information/report2011/p4_08.rtf
Quote
Проведение измерений передаваемой мощности на тепловых трубах 14Ф137 8974-0, 8975-0, 8961-0, 8962-0, 8963-0 в сотаве испытаний на функционирование в нормальных климатических условиях (ПСИ) для изделия 14Ф137 с №3

Well, that entry is for work in 2011, so apparently No.3 is still a prospect.
"I can’t tell you which asteroid, but there will be one in 2025," Bolden asserted.

Offline Stan Black

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« Last Edit: 01/10/2012 09:31 pm by Stan Black »

Offline Watchdog

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #7 on: 01/15/2012 04:12 pm »
Now, it seems that the long awaited launch of the Kondor E1 small radar earth observation satellite using a Strela booster will occur in March 2012 from Baikonur according to Aniks list.

Although this is not a photoreconnaissance satellite and it is listed as a civilian project it may provide the Russian military with useful data, too.

Does anybody know whether the Strela launcher will be added to the diversity of ICBM derived launchers (Vostochny launch site)? It was launched only a single time in 2003, and no further launches appear in Aniks list.

Sorry for being a little bit off topic with this question.


Offline Watchdog

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #9 on: 01/28/2012 09:59 am »
Now, according to the new entry in Aniks list, it seems that Russia plans to launch the second Persona satellite within this year. With Luch 5A in place and Luch 5B in launch preparation the transmission of digital pictures from Persona via the new data relay network will improve the efficiency of the Russian electronic reconnaissance.

Taken into account the many future projects listed and described in Stan Blacks source (http://www.cpnt.ru/userfiles/G_M_Polishuk.pdf) there seems to be no further need to launch analog photoreconnaissance satellites carrying reentry capsules. The launch of the eighth Kobalt-M satellite - no matter if launched this year or in the coming years - could therefore be the last of its kind or could even not take place at all.

However, Russia might focus its efforts to launch more radar satellites (Kondor E in March of this year and Arkon 2 in the coming years) which are capable to observe sites of interest under all-weather conditions (http://www.spacedaily.com/news/radar-05c.html).

Offline anik

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #10 on: 01/28/2012 11:01 am »
With Luch 5A in place and Luch 5B in launch preparation the transmission of digital pictures from Persona via the new data relay network will improve the efficiency of the Russian electronic reconnaissance

You have forgotten about Garpun military relay satellite.

Offline Watchdog

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #11 on: 01/28/2012 10:07 pm »
With Luch 5A in place and Luch 5B in launch preparation the transmission of digital pictures from Persona via the new data relay network will improve the efficiency of the Russian electronic reconnaissance

You have forgotten about Garpun military relay satellite.

You are right, thanks. The classified data from Persona are better transmitted via the Garpun satellite. The Luch data relay network is supposed to support ISS and civilian satellites. Do you have any information about the launch of the second Garpun?

Offline anik

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #12 on: 01/29/2012 06:17 am »
Do you have any information about the launch of the second Garpun?

I suppose this year or next year.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #13 on: 02/02/2012 05:19 pm »
Maybe this year's Persona #2 launch will replace the recently-annual Kobalt-M launch.
I've always been crazy but it's kept me from going insane - WJ.

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #14 on: 02/02/2012 07:01 pm »
Can this help provide a clue as to how many 11F695 Kobalt-M?

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3 ноября 2006
По РН 13м133с под КА «Кобальт-М» №559 в октябре стоит задача собрать ее до стыковки с двигателем и оформить. Эту машину до конца года надо постараться собрать и предъявить заказчику в полном объеме.
http://www.cosmopark.ru/lib/kiriln9.htm

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Кроме того, на основании договора N 6-01 от 01.07.2001 ФГУП "НИИМаш" изготовило и поставило в адрес ОАО "Машиностроительный завод "Арсенал" опытные двигатели 17Д51 для объекта 11Ф695 (N 558, N 559), используемого для выполнения работ (оказания услуг) непосредственно в космическом пространстве - код ОКДП 7310020, длительность производственного цикла которых согласно заключению Федерального космического агентства от 23.08.2005 также определена свыше 6 месяцев.
http://www.lawmix.ru/sverdlovsk/29514/

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На основании договора от 01.07.2001 N 6-01 предприятие изготовило и поставило в адрес открытого акционерного общества "Машиностроительный завод "Арсенал" опытные двигатели 17Д51 - 8 штук для объекта 11Ф695, используемого для выполнения работ (оказания услуг) непосредственно в космическом пространстве - код ОКДП 7310020, длительность производственного цикла которых согласно заключению Федерального космического агентства от 23.08.2005 также определена свыше 6 месяцев.
http://www.lawmix.ru/vas/108992/

Start date  End date    №    Spacecraft name
03.05.2006  19.07.2006  557  Kosmos 2420     
07.06.2007  23.08.2007  558  Kosmos 2427     
14.11.2008  23.02.2009  559  Kosmos 2445     
29.04.2009  27.07.2009  560  Kosmos 2450     
16.04.2010  21.07.2010  561  Kosmos 2462     
27.06.2011  24.10.2011  562  Kosmos 2472     


http://ofo.ikiweb.ru/bokz.php

http://www.niimashspace.ru/

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Как следует из оспариваемого решения, налоговому органу были представлены государственный контракт на поставку космического аппарата от 10.01.03 N С32-09-03, решение о поэтапном изготовлении изделия N 11Ф695-3-324-2005, а также дополнительные соглашения от 08.01.05 N ДС32-09-03/1-05/Е03 и от 01.01.05, N ДС32-09-02/1-05/Е03 (л.д. 35 - 49). Пунктом 3.5 указанных дополнительных соглашений определено, что работы, осуществляемые по государственному контракту, входят в состав комплекса подготовительных наземных работ, технологически обусловленного и неразрывно связанного с выполнением работ непосредственно в космическом пространстве, длительность производственного цикла выполнения которых составляет свыше 6 месяцев (код ОКДП - 7310020). Платежные поручения о перечислении авансовых платежей в сумме 2960000000 рублей содержат ссылки как на сами контракты, так и на дополнительные соглашения к ним (л.д. 53 - 55).Налоговый орган оценки положениям п. 3.5 дополнительных соглашений от 08.01.05 N ДС32-09-03/1-05/Е03 и от 01.01.05 N ДС32-09-02/1-05/Е03 не дал, сославшись лишь на то, что Общество поставляет космический аппарат.
http://www.lawmix.ru/13ap/55631/
« Last Edit: 02/02/2012 07:26 pm by Stan Black »

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #15 on: 02/03/2012 06:54 am »
Sorry I should have summarised… basically the contracts for 11F695 are from 2005, and one of those was for eight 17D51 rocket engines.
« Last Edit: 02/03/2012 06:54 am by Stan Black »

Offline Watchdog

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #16 on: 02/05/2012 09:01 am »
Sorry I should have summarised… basically the contracts for 11F695 are from 2005, and one of those was for eight 17D51 rocket engines.

The former U.S.S.R. and now Russia usually kept one or a few of the "outdated" spacecraft in reserve while introducing a new modification or design of spacecraft type. This reasonable strategy was also used e.g. in case of the manned Soyuz TMA/TMA-M spacecraft. It allows a proper testing of the new spacecraft design without temporarily loosing the basic capability of the particular spacecraft type.

Therefore, I expect the launch of the final Kobalt M-8 satellite after the successful launch and testing of Persona #2, most probably in the middle of 2013. The first Kobalt-M was launched on September 24, 2004 which adds the seventh satellite to Stan Blacks list. 

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #17 on: 02/05/2012 09:41 am »
I noticed that Cosmos 2410 was missing from the Kobalt-M listing - does anyone know what the serial number was, please?   Logic suggest 556 but such logic can't be relied upon.
I've always been crazy but it's kept me from going insane - WJ.

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #18 on: 02/05/2012 09:39 pm »
 I may have been a little confused… I thought the 17D51 was the complete engine installation like the 17D52… apparently not, it is a low thrust engine of which each Kobalt features more than one.

Perhaps I can redeem myself with this (where I should have looked from the start).
Quote
Дата: 14 ноября 2011 г.
В связи с этим, производимый космический аппарат "Кобальт" будет заменен космическим аппаратом другого производителя (время снятия с вооружения пока не определено, но не ранее, чем через 5 лет).
http://www.mzarsenal.spb.ru/assets/files/Ivanova/2011/E.otchet_3kv_2011.rtf

http://www.mzarsenal.spb.ru/59.html
http://www.zavjalov.okis.ru/12.html
« Last Edit: 02/06/2012 05:40 am by Stan Black »

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Future photoreconnaissance satellites
« Reply #19 on: 02/06/2012 09:37 am »
So this is what we can expect in the next year or so?

14F139 Pion-NKS (part of Liana)
Serial number 901
Launch vehicle Soyuz-2-1B
ELINT for Navy

14F145 Lotos-S (part of Liana)
Serial number 802
Launch vehicle Soyuz-2-1B
ELINT

11F695 Kobalt-M
Launch vehicle Soyuz-U PVB
Photographic reconnaissance

14F137 Persona
3rd manufactured?
Launch vehicle Soyuz-2-1B

17F112 Bars
Replacement for 11F660 Kometa

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