Author Topic: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?  (Read 11458 times)

Online Norm38

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #80 on: 09/29/2017 04:09 PM »
You mean the fill and vent lines?  And they're bidirectional?  I have no idea if the valves can support that or not.
« Last Edit: 09/29/2017 04:10 PM by Norm38 »

Offline rakaydos

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #81 on: 09/29/2017 04:27 PM »


4 pipes for fuel transfer. You can see in the render which side flares and which side narrows for mating the pipes.

Online John Alan

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #82 on: 09/29/2017 05:39 PM »
You mean the fill and vent lines?  And they're bidirectional?  I have no idea if the valves can support that or not.

On the rocket... yes... all liquid rated and capable of flow in either direction... use valves that allow this on the rocket...
Back them together in space... latch the connectors... and open all 4 valve lines...

On edit... added pic of my... 60 second yes that works... paper stand in
Apply thrust and fluid can be transferred in either direction by "gravity"...
« Last Edit: 09/29/2017 05:57 PM by John Alan »

Online shooter6947

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #83 on: 09/29/2017 05:47 PM »
So Musk confirmed tanker and spaceship will mate end-to-end and use ullage thrusters to settle the propellant down into the empty tanks of the ship.

He said the plan is to reuse the existing plumbing from the booster to transfer fuel.  But in the image here, if say CH4 is on the left and O2 is on the right, when the ship and tanker dock end-to-end, then those connections don't line up.  They might if the tanker rolled over, but that's not what's shown.

Discuss.

Just put CH4 on the top, and O2 on the bottom.

Offline DanielW

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #84 on: 09/29/2017 06:18 PM »
I find it interesting that the spaceship will be fueled by the booster on earth. I would assume that means that all other umbilical connections for power/data etc will also come from the booster.

Offline Jim

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #85 on: 09/29/2017 06:25 PM »
You mean the fill and vent lines?  And they're bidirectional?  I have no idea if the valves can support that or not.

They are called fill and drain lines.  The tanks have to be emptied for scrubs.

Offline envy887

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #86 on: 09/29/2017 06:32 PM »
And they won't use milligees of this to do the actual transfer. The thrust is to settle the propellant. The transfer is driven by pressure differential.

Online Norm38

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #87 on: 09/30/2017 04:10 AM »
You mean the fill and vent lines?  And they're bidirectional?  I have no idea if the valves can support that or not.

They are called fill and drain lines.  The tanks have to be emptied for scrubs.

Got it. So when the separate ships are fueled for launch on Earth, are they filled from the top or the bottom?  From John Alan's sketch, they will fill from the bottom due to ullage thrust. 
« Last Edit: 09/30/2017 04:12 AM by Norm38 »

Online Lars-J

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #88 on: 09/30/2017 05:45 AM »
You mean the fill and vent lines?  And they're bidirectional?  I have no idea if the valves can support that or not.

They are called fill and drain lines.  The tanks have to be emptied for scrubs.

Got it. So when the separate ships are fueled for launch on Earth, are they filled from the top or the bottom?  From John Alan's sketch, they will fill from the bottom due to ullage thrust.

F9 fills its stages from the bottom, as does most (all?) liquid launch vehicles.

Offline Semmel

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #89 on: 09/30/2017 11:35 AM »
They could just mount the pipes at the front and back if rotating 180 degrees is a problem. I dont think the tanker will have reversed pipes  because this makes the ground equipment more complicated. Just have them front and back and you can stick the two second stages together as shown in the image.

Offline Nibb31

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Re: The best method to transfer Methalox Fuel in space?
« Reply #90 on: 09/30/2017 11:40 AM »
There is no need to rotate. The male/female connections are symmetrical, as shown in SpaceX's slide. It's quite clear.

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