I've been trying to make a list of capabilities for the big rockets under development that everyone is always discussing.
I've been trying to make a list of capabilities for the big rockets under development that everyone is always discussing. Many estimates, which are mine, so feel free to critique. Here goes. =====================================================Vehicle 1st Launch TransLunar TransMars =====================================================Falcon 9 Blk 5 2017? ~2,500 kg? ~2,000 kg?Falcon 9 Blk 5-X 2017? ~4,000 kg? ~3,000 kg?Falcon Heavy 2018? ~5,500 kg ~4,900 kgFalcon Heavy-X 2018? ~19,000 kg 16,800 kgSLS Blk 1 2019? 24,500 kg 19,500 kgVulcan Centaur 551 2019? ~6,500 kg? ~5,000 kg?New Glenn 2 Stg 2020? ~9,000 kg ~8,000 kgNGL-5xx 2021? ~6,000 kg ~4,700 kgSLS Blk 1B 2022? 39,000 kg 32,000 kgVulcan ACES 56x 2023? ~10,600 kg? ~8,400 kg?NGL-5xx-XL 2023? ~10,300 kg ~8,200 kg?New Glenn 3 Stg 2025? ~17,000 kg? ~15,000 kg?SLS Blk 2 2029? ~50,000 kg ~45,000 kg====================================================="X" Denotes Expendable Version - Ed Kyle
=====================================================Vehicle 1st Launch TransLunar TransMars =====================================================Falcon 9 Blk 5 2017? ~2,500 kg? ~2,000 kg?Falcon 9 Blk 5-X 2017? ~4,000 kg? ~3,000 kg?Falcon Heavy 2018? ~5,500 kg ~4,900 kgFalcon Heavy-X 2018? ~19,000 kg 16,800 kgSLS Blk 1 2019? 24,500 kg 19,500 kgVulcan Centaur 551 2019? ~6,500 kg? ~5,000 kg?New Glenn 2 Stg 2020? ~9,000 kg ~8,000 kgNGL-5xx 2021? ~6,000 kg ~4,700 kgSLS Blk 1B 2022? 39,000 kg 32,000 kgVulcan ACES 56x 2023? ~10,600 kg? ~8,400 kg?NGL-5xx-XL 2023? ~10,300 kg ~8,200 kg?New Glenn 3 Stg 2025? ~17,000 kg? ~15,000 kg?SLS Blk 2 2029? ~50,000 kg ~45,000 kg====================================================="X" Denotes Expendable Version
Quote from: edkyle99 on 06/02/2017 08:58 pmI've been trying to make a list of capabilities for the big rockets under development that everyone is always discussing.I'm wondering whether New Armstrong is going to be in ITS territory or just SLS/Saturn V.
Also; the expended core but the two boosters landing downrange on the barges.
Quote from: MATTBLAK on 06/03/2017 02:26 amAlso; the expended core but the two boosters landing downrange on the barges.There are many theoretical options, but I think Ed wants to concentrate on the practical and more likely options.
The way SpaceX wants to fly it (recovering boosters and first stage) it will barely boost 5.5 tonnes toward the Moon...
Quote from: Paul451 on 06/04/2017 06:55 pmQuote from: edkyle99 on 05/27/2017 10:12 pmSo, NASA is supposed to just wait for these proposed launch vehicles to finally appear? Falcon Heavy was supposed to fly in 2013. [...] NASA can't wait for promises when it has the propulsion in hand.What "propulsion" does NASA have "in hand"? They haven't even figured out how to weld the tanks.[...] So in what way would NASA be "waiting" for FH, but have SLS "in hand"?NASA has RS-25 and five-segment booster and RL10 and, for Orion, AJ-10. In-hand.
Quote from: edkyle99 on 05/27/2017 10:12 pmSo, NASA is supposed to just wait for these proposed launch vehicles to finally appear? Falcon Heavy was supposed to fly in 2013. [...] NASA can't wait for promises when it has the propulsion in hand.What "propulsion" does NASA have "in hand"? They haven't even figured out how to weld the tanks.[...] So in what way would NASA be "waiting" for FH, but have SLS "in hand"?
So, NASA is supposed to just wait for these proposed launch vehicles to finally appear? Falcon Heavy was supposed to fly in 2013. [...] NASA can't wait for promises when it has the propulsion in hand.
[Falcon Heavy] The way SpaceX wants to fly it (recovering boosters and first stage)
Even if the entire rocket was thrown away it would not match even SLS Block 1
How complicated could refueling a FH upper stage be?
Two FH launches are still cheaper than one SLS launch.
Quote from: Lars-J on 06/04/2017 06:26 amQuote from: MATTBLAK on 06/03/2017 02:26 amAlso; the expended core but the two boosters landing downrange on the barges.There are many theoretical options, but I think Ed wants to concentrate on the practical and more likely options.Just as likely as the others. We may see it on the Lunar Dragon mission.
Quote from: spacenut on 06/06/2017 12:21 pmTwo FH launches are still cheaper than one SLS launch.Two fully expendable FH launches are cheaper than four months of SLS funding.
I've been trying to make a list of capabilities for the big rockets under development that everyone is always discussing. Many estimates, which are mine, so feel free to critique. Here goes. =====================================================Vehicle 1st Launch TransLunar TransMars =====================================================Falcon 9 Blk 5 2017? ~3,000 kg? ~2,500 kg?Falcon 9 Blk 5-X 2017? ~5,000 kg 4,020 kgFalcon Heavy 2018? ~5,500 kg ~4,900 kgFalcon Heavy-X 2018? ~19,000 kg 16,800 kgSLS Blk 1 2019? 24,500 kg 19,500 kgVulcan Centaur 551 2019? ~6,500 kg? ~5,000 kg?New Glenn 2 Stg 2020? ~9,000 kg ~8,000 kgNGL-5xx 2021? ~6,000 kg ~4,700 kgSLS Blk 1B 2022? 39,000 kg 32,000 kgVulcan ACES 56x 2023? ~10,600 kg? ~8,400 kg?NGL-5xx-XL 2023? ~10,300 kg ~8,200 kg?New Glenn 3 Stg 2025? ~17,000 kg? ~15,000 kg?SLS Blk 2 2029? ~50,000 kg ~45,000 kg====================================================="X" Denotes Expendable Version
=====================================================Vehicle 1st Launch TransLunar TransMars =====================================================Falcon 9 Blk 5 2017? ~3,000 kg? ~2,500 kg?Falcon 9 Blk 5-X 2017? ~5,000 kg 4,020 kgFalcon Heavy 2018? ~5,500 kg ~4,900 kgFalcon Heavy-X 2018? ~19,000 kg 16,800 kgSLS Blk 1 2019? 24,500 kg 19,500 kgVulcan Centaur 551 2019? ~6,500 kg? ~5,000 kg?New Glenn 2 Stg 2020? ~9,000 kg ~8,000 kgNGL-5xx 2021? ~6,000 kg ~4,700 kgSLS Blk 1B 2022? 39,000 kg 32,000 kgVulcan ACES 56x 2023? ~10,600 kg? ~8,400 kg?NGL-5xx-XL 2023? ~10,300 kg ~8,200 kg?New Glenn 3 Stg 2025? ~17,000 kg? ~15,000 kg?SLS Blk 2 2029? ~50,000 kg ~45,000 kg====================================================="X" Denotes Expendable Version
=====================================================Vehicle 1st Launch TransLunar TransMars =====================================================Falcon 9 Blk 5-X 2017? ~5,800 kg 4,020 kgFalcon Heavy-X 2018? ~20,650 kg 16,800 kgNew Glenn 2 Stg 2020? ~7,725 kg ~8,000 kg====================================================="X" Denotes Expendable Version
Quote from: Paul451 on 06/06/2017 04:34 pmQuote from: spacenut on 06/06/2017 12:21 pmTwo FH launches are still cheaper than one SLS launch.Two fully expendable FH launches are cheaper than four months of SLS funding.Since this isn't published by SpaceX, what are your assumptions for these prices?
I've been trying to make a list of capabilities for the big rockets under development that everyone is always discussing. Many estimates, which are mine, so feel free to critique. Here goes. =====================================================Vehicle 1st Launch TransLunar TransMars =====================================================Falcon 9 Blk 5 2017? ~3,000 kg? ~2,500 kg?Falcon 9 Blk 5-X 2017? ~5,000 kg 4,020 kgFalcon Heavy 2018? ~5,500 kg ~4,900 kgFalcon Heavy-X 2018? ~19,000 kg 16,800 kgSLS Blk 1 2019? 24,500 kg 19,500 kgVulcan Centaur 551 2019? ~6,500 kg? ~5,000 kg?New Glenn 2 Stg 2020? ~9,000 kg ~8,000 kgNGL-5xx 2021? ~6,000 kg ~4,700 kgSLS Blk 1B 2022? 39,000 kg 32,000 kgVulcan ACES 56x 2023? ~10,600 kg? ~8,400 kg?NGL-5xx-XL 2023? ~10,300 kg ~8,200 kg?New Glenn 3 Stg 2025? ~17,000 kg? ~15,000 kg?SLS Blk 2 2029? ~50,000 kg ~45,000 kg====================================================="X" Denotes Expendable VersionEDIT: Updated Falcon 9 Payload - Ed Kyleedit/gongora: moved from SLS thread