Author Topic: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017  (Read 30255 times)

Offline Nicolas PILLET

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Third launch of Soyuz-2.1v will occur from Plesetsk on 23th June 2017, according to my informations.
« Last Edit: 06/23/2017 09:00 AM by input~2 »
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Offline Steven Pietrobon

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - 23th June 2017
« Reply #1 on: 06/03/2017 07:11 AM »
Is it carrying one of these payloads?

Geo IK-2 N3
14F150 N2
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - 23th June 2017
« Reply #2 on: 06/03/2017 10:07 AM »
Is it carrying one of these payloads?

Geo IK-2 N3
14F150 N2
Could be 14F150 (whatever it is). The satellite has long been announced.
Geo-IK 2 13L with Rokot (according to NK-Forum)
« Last Edit: 06/03/2017 10:22 AM by Alter Sachse »

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - 23th June 2017
« Reply #3 on: 06/03/2017 11:57 AM »
14F150 (whatever it is)*

*We have already discussed, I can not find the thread.
A. Zak writes: Napryazhenie (see 14F150) Nevilir-3U, Nevilir-P project (Geodesy)
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/spacecraft_military.html

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - 23th June 2017
« Reply #4 on: 06/03/2017 02:31 PM »
14F150 (whatever it is)*

*We have already discussed, I can not find the thread.
A. Zak writes: Napryazhenie (see 14F150) Nevilir-3U, Nevilir-P project (Geodesy)
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/spacecraft_military.html


30.07.2015 - Soyuz-2.1v n°3L - Plesetsk 43/4 - 14F150 n°2

Hmm Stan has uncovered many of those product designations, but 14F150 isn't in the list....and it's #2 too....  :-X


Possibly geodesy?

See here:-
http://novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/forum/messages/forum12/topic2063/message1385103/#message1385103

I noticed Mr. Zak has updated his website too (Google cache shows changes after June 10th), so I don’t know if that gives it legetimacy.

I overlooked this:-
Quote
1.3. В целях расширения рынка сбыта выпускаемых приборов проводится согласование
протоколов разрешённого применения на применение приборов на КА «Спектр-РГ», «Нивелир-Л», «Напряжение-Л», «Резонанс», 14Ф01.
http://www.geofizika-cosmos.ru/assets/files/otchyotnost/godovoj-otchet-2013.pdf

So article 14Ф150 is satellite «Nivelir-L»?

Maybe it is a double satellite, №1 and №2?

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - 23th June 2017
« Reply #5 on: 06/03/2017 03:47 PM »
14F150 (whatever it is)*

*We have already discussed, I can not find the thread.
A. Zak writes: Napryazhenie (see 14F150) Nevilir-3U, Nevilir-P project (Geodesy)
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/spacecraft_military.html


30.07.2015 - Soyuz-2.1v n°3L - Plesetsk 43/4 - 14F150 n°2

Hmm Stan has uncovered many of those product designations, but 14F150 isn't in the list....and it's #2 too....  :-X


Possibly geodesy?

See here:-
http://novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/forum/messages/forum12/topic2063/message1385103/#message1385103

I noticed Mr. Zak has updated his website too (Google cache shows changes after June 10th), so I don’t know if that gives it legetimacy.

I overlooked this:-
Quote
1.3. В целях расширения рынка сбыта выпускаемых приборов проводится согласование
протоколов разрешённого применения на применение приборов на КА «Спектр-РГ», «Нивелир-Л», «Напряжение-Л», «Резонанс», 14Ф01.
http://www.geofizika-cosmos.ru/assets/files/otchyotnost/godovoj-otchet-2013.pdf

So article 14Ф150 is satellite «Nivelir-L»?

Maybe it is a double satellite, №1 and №2?
I can remember, but did not find it. Thank you !

Online Galactic Penguin SST

Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #6 on: 06/19/2017 03:15 PM »
Any air/marine space closure notices out there that can hint on the launch window and target orbit?  ::)
Chinese spaceflight is a cosmic riddle wrapped in a galactic mystery inside an orbital enigma... - (not) Winston Churchill

Offline Artyom.

Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #7 on: 06/19/2017 03:52 PM »
From NK:

23 Jun at 18:04:39 UTC
"Earth is the cradle of humanity, but one cannot live in a cradle forever." - Konstantin Eduardovich Tsiolkovsky.

Offline input~2

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Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #8 on: 06/20/2017 01:25 PM »
Any air/marine space closure notices out there that can hint on the launch window and target orbit?  ::)

G3262/17 - ATS RTE B488 SEGMENT NUTLA - LIMUS CLSD. SFC - UNL, DAILY 1800-1900, 23 JUN 18:00 2017 UNTIL 24 JUN 19:00 2017. CREATED: 19 JUN 05:57 2017
G3263/17 - TEMPO DANGER AREA FOR ACFT FLT ACT WI COORD: 701800N0334900E-701200N0340800E-695400N0344300E-693300N0344700E- 692500N0341500E-693500N0333700E-695300N0330500E-701200N0331100E- 701800N0334900E. SFC - UNL, DAILY 1800-1900, 23 JUN 18:00 2017 UNTIL 24 JUN 19:00 2017. CREATED: 19 JUN 06:01 2017
A2101/17 -  RECEIVED FROM MAIN AIR TRAFIFIC MANAGMENT CENTER OF RUSSIA: ROCKET IMPACT AREA IN THE BARENTS SEA: 7559N 02126E - 7550N 02202E - 7531N 02256E - 7521N 02252E - 7515N 02213E - 7524N 02129E - 7536N 02051E - 7550N 02030E - (7559N 02126E). GND - UNL, DAILY 1800-1900, 23 JUN 18:00 2017 UNTIL 24 JUN 19:00 2017. CREATED: 20 JUN 12:44 2017

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #9 on: 06/20/2017 02:31 PM »
What results in the inclination ? 98° ?

Offline input~2

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Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #10 on: 06/20/2017 04:47 PM »
What results in the inclination ? 98° ?
Could be (as hinted when comparing with GEO-IK-2 launch)

Offline zubenelgenubi

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Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #11 on: 06/20/2017 08:24 PM »
If current launch schedules, Russian and American, remain unchanged:

This payload's boost into orbit, with launch scheduled at 18:04 UTC, will still be in progress when the Falcon 9 carrying  BulgariaSat 1 lifts off approximately six minutes later.

Will the Soyuz Blok A still be in operation six minutes later?  Or will staging to the Blok I have already occurred?

***
In a related question, have two orbital launches ever overlapped before?
« Last Edit: 06/20/2017 08:34 PM by zubenelgenubi »
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Online William Graham

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Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #12 on: 06/20/2017 09:26 PM »
If current launch schedules, Russian and American, remain unchanged:

This payload's boost into orbit, with launch scheduled at 18:04 UTC, will still be in progress when the Falcon 9 carrying  BulgariaSat 1 lifts off approximately six minutes later.

[...]

In a related question, have two orbital launches ever overlapped before?

Yes. The shortest ever time between two launches was 82±30 seconds on 18 August 1960 - between a Thor-Agena from Vandenberg AFB and a Thor-Ablestar from Cape Canaveral. The Thor-Ablestar failed to orbit. The reason for the margin of error is that the Thor-Ablestar launch time is only known to the minute, while the Thor-Agena is known to the second. It could have been as little as 52 seconds, or up to 112.

The shortest time between two successful launches is 330±30 seconds (i.e. between 5 and 6 minutes), between a Tsyklon-2 launch from Baikonur and a Soyuz-U launch from Plesetsk on 16 September 1977. If Soyuz-2.1v launches at 18:04:39, and Falcon 9 launches at 18:10:00, the gap will be 321 seconds. So assuming success it would be within the margin of error for the shortest time between two successful launches.
« Last Edit: 06/20/2017 09:30 PM by William Graham »

Offline Nicolas PILLET

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Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #13 on: 06/20/2017 10:18 PM »
And remember that a Blue-Scout-2 suborbital launch occured from CCAFS less than one second after the launch of Gagarin !
Nicolas PILLET
Kosmonavtika : The French site on Russian Space

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: tbd - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #14 on: 06/21/2017 04:32 PM »
The Soyuz should be at the launch complex

Online Chris Bergin

Is this one still on track to troll the Falcon 9 launch?

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #16 on: 06/23/2017 04:45 PM »
Is this one still on track to troll the Falcon 9 launch?
AFAIK, Yes.
http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html

Online Satori

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #17 on: 06/23/2017 05:59 PM »
We are now 5 minutes from the expected launch time. Scanning Russian news sources for any info about the launch...

Online Satori

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #18 on: 06/23/2017 06:04 PM »
Schedule launch time was 18:04:33UTC. So, a secretive Russian satellite should be on its way to orbit if everything went as planned.
« Last Edit: 06/23/2017 06:40 PM by Satori »

Offline Artyom.

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #20 on: 06/23/2017 06:26 PM »
Anatoly Zak is reporting that Volga space tug separated from 2nd stage of Soyuz-2-1v rocket.

https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/878317428991598594

Offline Artyom.

Confirmed. The Volga  successfully  separated from the launch vehicle.

http://tass.ru/kosmos/4362668
"Earth is the cradle of humanity, but one cannot live in a cradle forever." - Konstantin Eduardovich Tsiolkovsky.

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #22 on: 06/23/2017 06:42 PM »
Anatoly Zak is reporting that Volga space tug will continue its flight for ~1.5 hours before releasing its payload in its final orbit.
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/878318541035913216

Offline Magic

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #23 on: 06/23/2017 07:21 PM »
Confirmed. The Volga  successfully  separated from the launch vehicle.

http://tass.ru/kosmos/4362668

Back in the good old Cold War days Tass used to report Kosmos numbers and orbital perimeters!
« Last Edit: 06/23/2017 07:29 PM by Magic »

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #24 on: 06/23/2017 07:41 PM »
Confirmed. The Volga  successfully  separated from the launch vehicle.

http://tass.ru/kosmos/4362668

Back in the good old Cold War days Tass used to report Kosmos numbers and orbital perimeters!
Payload separation from Volga has yet to occur but is coming up on the timeline.

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #25 on: 06/23/2017 07:54 PM »
Anatoly Zak is reporting that Russian Ministry of Defense confirmed successful launch of Soyuz-2-1v rocket today with a military spacecraft!
https://twitter.com/RussianSpaceWeb/status/878338636948754433
« Last Edit: 06/23/2017 07:56 PM by russianhalo117 »

Offline input~2

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« Last Edit: 06/23/2017 08:57 PM by input~2 »

Online Chris Bergin

Cool, but some launch photos would be great!

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #28 on: 06/23/2017 08:42 PM »
« Last Edit: 06/23/2017 09:00 PM by input~2 »

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #29 on: 06/23/2017 09:10 PM »
fairing serial is 98 KS 1000-0 Launcher serial is No. 78072003
Payload is called Nivelir-ZU No.1 (14F150)

http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
Quote
...
The Nivelir project reaches launch pad?

The Russian government has released very little information about the upcoming flight, but it appears that it might be carrying the first of several 14F150 Napryazhenie geodetic satellites developed within the Nivelir-ZU project. The Russian word "napryazhenie" stands for voltage, while "nivelir" means level.
...
« Last Edit: 06/23/2017 09:21 PM by russianhalo117 »

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #30 on: 06/23/2017 09:21 PM »
fairing serial is 98 KS 1000-0 Launcher serial is No. 78072003
Payload is called Nivelir-ZU No.1 (14F150)

The rocket to be shipped was to have the same factory serial number of 3/138, so both should have the same tail number.
http://www.zakupki.gov.ru/223/purchase/public/download/download.html?id=19004333
http://www.zakupki.gov.ru/223/purchase/public/purchase/info/documents.html?noticeId=3248479
« Last Edit: 06/23/2017 09:21 PM by Stan Black »


Offline jcm

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #32 on: 06/23/2017 10:50 PM »
fairing serial is 98 KS 1000-0 Launcher serial is No. 78072003
Payload is called Nivelir-ZU No.1 (14F150)

http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
Quote
...
The Nivelir project reaches launch pad?

The Russian government has released very little information about the upcoming flight, but it appears that it might be carrying the first of several 14F150 Napryazhenie geodetic satellites developed within the Nivelir-ZU project. The Russian word "napryazhenie" stands for voltage, while "nivelir" means level.
...

Rather than being called Napryazhenie No. 1? Anatoly's page seemed to imply Nivelir-ZU is the broader project
and the satellite is Napryazhenie.
Any indication of Volga serial number?
-----------------------------

Jonathan McDowell
http://planet4589.org

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #33 on: 06/23/2017 10:53 PM »
fairing serial is 98 KS 1000-0 Launcher serial is No. 78072003
Payload is called Nivelir-ZU No.1 (14F150)

http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
Quote
...
The Nivelir project reaches launch pad?

The Russian government has released very little information about the upcoming flight, but it appears that it might be carrying the first of several 14F150 Napryazhenie geodetic satellites developed within the Nivelir-ZU project. The Russian word "napryazhenie" stands for voltage, while "nivelir" means level.
...

Rather than being called Napryazhenie No. 1? Anatoly's page seemed to imply Nivelir-ZU is the broader project
and the satellite is Napryazhenie.
Any indication of Volga serial number?
No photographic evidence of serial but Stan might know.

Offline Lewis007

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« Last Edit: 06/24/2017 06:41 AM by Lewis007 »

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #35 on: 06/24/2017 08:26 AM »
http://tass.ru/kosmos/4362793

The press service of the Ministry of Defence describes the payload as follows :

"The satellite is a space platform on which several types of payloads can be installed. The payload [for this mission] is equipment for remote sensing of the Earth and equipment to photograph objects in space".

While "remote sensing" may still be consistent with a geodetic mission, photographing objects in space clearly is not.




Offline Artyom.

Video of the launch on YouTube

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Online Galactic Penguin SST

3 objects (satellite, Volga and 2nd stage(?)) found by NORAD; satellite in 660 km high, 98.05 deg. inclination SSO.
Chinese spaceflight is a cosmic riddle wrapped in a galactic mystery inside an orbital enigma... - (not) Winston Churchill

Offline Alter Sachse

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Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #39 on: 06/24/2017 11:53 AM »
3 objects (satellite, Volga and 2nd stage(?)) found by NORAD; satellite in 660 km high, 98.05 deg. inclination SSO.
More details below:

2017-037A/42798 in 654 x 669 km x 98.05°
2017-037B/42799 in 652 x 669 km x 98.05°
2017-037C/42800 in 284 x 650 km x 98.06°

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #40 on: 06/24/2017 02:24 PM »
Possible Volga reentry zone?

SOUTH PACIFIC.
1. HAZARDOUS OPERATIONS SPACE DEBRIS
231800Z TO 240800Z AND 241800Z TO 250800Z JUN
IN AREA BETWEEN
30-00S 60-00S AND 090-00W 175-00W.
2. CANCEL THIS MSG 250900Z JUN 17.//

Authority: NAVAREA XIV 55/17 192115Z JUN 17.


Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #41 on: 06/24/2017 02:33 PM »
Possible Volga reentry zone?

SOUTH PACIFIC.
1. HAZARDOUS OPERATIONS SPACE DEBRIS
231800Z TO 240800Z AND 241800Z TO 250800Z JUN
IN AREA BETWEEN
30-00S 60-00S AND 090-00W 175-00W.
2. CANCEL THIS MSG 250900Z JUN 17.//

Authority: NAVAREA XIV 55/17 192115Z JUN 17.


Volga or Second Stage.

Online edkyle99

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #42 on: 06/24/2017 04:12 PM »
3 objects (satellite, Volga and 2nd stage(?)) found by NORAD; satellite in 660 km high, 98.05 deg. inclination SSO.
More details below:

2017-037A/42798 in 654 x 669 km x 98.05°
2017-037B/42799 in 652 x 669 km x 98.05°
2017-037C/42800 in 284 x 650 km x 98.06°
This is sun sync, or nearly-so.  Don't most geodetic satellites reside in other orbit types?

 - Ed Kyle

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #43 on: 06/24/2017 05:41 PM »
3 objects (satellite, Volga and 2nd stage(?)) found by NORAD; satellite in 660 km high, 98.05 deg. inclination SSO.
More details below:

2017-037A/42798 in 654 x 669 km x 98.05°
2017-037B/42799 in 652 x 669 km x 98.05°
2017-037C/42800 in 284 x 650 km x 98.06°
This is sun sync, or nearly-so.  Don't most geodetic satellites reside in other orbit types?

 - Ed Kyle
I'm not sure it's a geodetic satellite.
see reply #36:
"The payload [for this mission] is equipment for remote sensing of the Earth and equipment to photograph objects in space".
sun sync is suitable for "remote sensing"
« Last Edit: 06/24/2017 05:51 PM by Alter Sachse »

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #44 on: 06/24/2017 06:06 PM »
3 objects (satellite, Volga and 2nd stage(?)) found by NORAD; satellite in 660 km high, 98.05 deg. inclination SSO.
More details below:

2017-037A/42798 in 654 x 669 km x 98.05°
2017-037B/42799 in 652 x 669 km x 98.05°
2017-037C/42800 in 284 x 650 km x 98.06°
This is sun sync, or nearly-so.  Don't most geodetic satellites reside in other orbit types?

 - Ed Kyle
I'm not sure it's a geodetic satellite.
see reply #36:
"The payload [for this mission] is equipment for remote sensing of the Earth and equipment to photograph objects in space".
sun sync is suitable for "remote sensing"
Wikipedia (German version):
"The selected orbit height of the satellites depends on the application spectrum and is usually at least 800 km."
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geod%C3%A4tischer_Satellit

Offline Magic

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #45 on: 06/24/2017 06:35 PM »
With the Teledyne Brown 1980’s “Cosmos Calculator” it shows a flight with 98° - 600 x 660 km perimeters as Remote Sensing missions, but launched from Tyuratam (due to Cold War launch angle restrictions).
A military version of a Meteor-Priroda now using Plesetsk perhaps?
« Last Edit: 06/24/2017 06:37 PM by Magic »

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #46 on: 06/24/2017 06:38 PM »
Possible Volga reentry zone?

SOUTH PACIFIC.
1. HAZARDOUS OPERATIONS SPACE DEBRIS
231800Z TO 240800Z AND 241800Z TO 250800Z JUN
IN AREA BETWEEN
30-00S 60-00S AND 090-00W 175-00W.
2. CANCEL THIS MSG 250900Z JUN 17.//

Authority: NAVAREA XIV 55/17 192115Z JUN 17.


Volga or Second Stage.
I would think Volga reentry is more probable in the timeframe indicated in the navigational warning above, since I would expect Volga to have conducted a deorbiting burn for reentry as was the case in past similar launches


Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #47 on: 06/24/2017 07:32 PM »
 Anatoly Zak‏ @RussianSpaceWeb 2 hours ago

Sources: Volga stage performed end-of-mission operations after #Soyuz-2-1v launch yesterday, data shows. DETAILS: http://www.russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html#orbit

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #48 on: 06/24/2017 07:39 PM »
Soviet/russian geodetic satellites

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #49 on: 06/24/2017 08:13 PM »
With the Teledyne Brown 1980’s “Cosmos Calculator” it shows a flight with 98° - 600 x 660 km perimeters as Remote Sensing missions, but launched from Tyuratam (due to Cold War launch angle restrictions).
A military version of a Meteor-Priroda now using Plesetsk perhaps?

Although retired, Nick Johnson will be delighted to know that this is still in use!

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #50 on: 06/24/2017 08:54 PM »
K2519 is almost in plane with 2013-028A. Don't know if this is intentional or not.

This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #51 on: 06/24/2017 09:27 PM »
K2519 is almost in plane with 2013-028A. Don't know if this is intentional or not.
That was Kosmos 2486 ("Persona 2")
98.30° 99.76 min 714 km 733 km

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #52 on: 06/24/2017 10:21 PM »
Kosmos 2519 98.05 97.97 654 669
Resurs-O1     98.05 97.98 661 663 (launched 4.11.1994)
Almost the same orbit ...

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #53 on: 06/25/2017 08:58 AM »
fairing serial is 98 KS 1000-0 Launcher serial is No. 78072003
Payload is called Nivelir-ZU No.1 (14F150)

http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
Quote
...
The Nivelir project reaches launch pad?

The Russian government has released very little information about the upcoming flight, but it appears that it might be carrying the first of several 14F150 Napryazhenie geodetic satellites developed within the Nivelir-ZU project. The Russian word "napryazhenie" stands for voltage, while "nivelir" means level.
...

‘ZU’ is a component?

From Progress procurement plan of 2013 there are four entries:-
Quote
Поставка ЭРИ ОП и ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ ОКР «Нивелир»
Изготовление и поставка модулей ЗУ для изделия 14Ф150 (ОКР «Нивелир-ЗУ»)
Поставка ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение омплектования ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»
Изготовление и поставка модулей ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»
ОКР - опытно-конструкторские работы
КА is the abbreviation for satellite.

‘Nivelir-ZU’ is the name of the work, not the satellite?

In 2014:-
Quote
Поставка модулей ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ в обеспечение комплектования ОКР «Нивелир-Л-ЗУ»
Поставка ЭРИ ОП и ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ ОКР «Нивелир»
Поставка ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»

From 2015:-
Quote
Модули ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ для изделия КА 14Ф155
Поставка модулей ХП-М, ЗУ, ЦСВВ для образца технологического блока ЗУ для стенда КА 14Ф150

Progress procurement plans can be found here:-
http://www.samspace.ru/zakupki/plany_zakupok/

Further indication Nivelir-L and Napryazhenie-L are different satellites:-
Quote
1.3. В целях расширения рынка сбыта выпускаемых приборов проводится согласование
протоколов разрешённого применения на применение приборов на КА «Спектр-РГ», «Нивелир-Л», «Напряжение-Л», «Резонанс», 14Ф01.
http://www.geofizika-cosmos.ru/assets/files/otchyotnost/godovoj-otchet-2013.pdf

Just to confirm Mr. Pillet’s information that 14Ф150 was a payload for a Soyuz rocket, comes from TSENKI procurement plan of 2015:-
Quote
Дооборудование СК 17П32-С4 под КА 14Ф150
http://www.zakupki.gov.ru/223/plan/public/download/download.html?id=1677613 http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=26990.msg1339253#msg1339253

Also possibly the connection with Lavochkin can be found from this entry in Progress procurement plan:-
Quote
Изготовление и поставка модулей ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ для аппаратуры МКА-ФКИ

As to its function, the only piece of information is this:-
Quote
4 ЦНИИ МО РФ совместно с кооперацией подготовлена и представлена заказчику тематическая карточка на проведение базовой НИР «Нивелир-П» в 2014- 2015 годы «Комплексные исследования путей создания многоярусной космиче- ской системы мониторинга геодезических параметров Земли в интересах обеспечения стратегических сил и высокоточного оружия. Экспериментальная отработка ключевых элементов системы».
http://www.glonass-center.ru/aboutIAC/Report%20by%20Kosenko%20Zvonar_3.pdf

Is it possible there are two Nivelir projects?
« Last Edit: 06/25/2017 09:19 AM by Stan Black »

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #54 on: 06/25/2017 10:50 AM »
fairing serial is 98 KS 1000-0 Launcher serial is No. 78072003
Payload is called Nivelir-ZU No.1 (14F150)

http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
Quote
...
The Nivelir project reaches launch pad?

The Russian government has released very little information about the upcoming flight, but it appears that it might be carrying the first of several 14F150 Napryazhenie geodetic satellites developed within the Nivelir-ZU project. The Russian word "napryazhenie" stands for voltage, while "nivelir" means level.
...

‘ZU’ is a component?

From Progress procurement plan of 2013 there are four entries:-
Quote
Поставка ЭРИ ОП и ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ ОКР «Нивелир»
Изготовление и поставка модулей ЗУ для изделия 14Ф150 (ОКР «Нивелир-ЗУ»)
Поставка ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение омплектования ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»
Изготовление и поставка модулей ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»
ОКР - опытно-конструкторские работы
КА is the abbreviation for satellite.

‘Nivelir-ZU’ is the name of the work, not the satellite?

In 2014:-
Quote
Поставка модулей ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ в обеспечение комплектования ОКР «Нивелир-Л-ЗУ»
Поставка ЭРИ ОП и ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ ОКР «Нивелир»
Поставка ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»

From 2015:-
Quote
Модули ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ для изделия КА 14Ф155
Поставка модулей ХП-М, ЗУ, ЦСВВ для образца технологического блока ЗУ для стенда КА 14Ф150
In my ineducated opinion, ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ modules are some low-level electronic components within ЗУ block which probably means запоминающее устройство (memory unit) and as such exists in different configurations within many spacecraft and ground support equipment items.
So it doesn't make sense to think that Nivelir-ZU may be a spacecraft name or a project name. Judging from the quotes above, it can me a name for a very small work of the larger Nivelir project. And NPP OPTEKS (Being a subsidiary of RKTs Progress) orders this ЗУ block to use in a larger assembly (maybe onboard computer or control system) to be delivered to a producer of a spacecraft.
« Last Edit: 06/25/2017 03:23 PM by Liss »
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #55 on: 06/25/2017 04:17 PM »
fairing serial is 98 KS 1000-0 Launcher serial is No. 78072003
Payload is called Nivelir-ZU No.1 (14F150)

http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
Quote
...
The Nivelir project reaches launch pad?

The Russian government has released very little information about the upcoming flight, but it appears that it might be carrying the first of several 14F150 Napryazhenie geodetic satellites developed within the Nivelir-ZU project. The Russian word "napryazhenie" stands for voltage, while "nivelir" means level.
...

‘ZU’ is a component?

From Progress procurement plan of 2013 there are four entries:-
Quote
Поставка ЭРИ ОП и ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ ОКР «Нивелир»
Изготовление и поставка модулей ЗУ для изделия 14Ф150 (ОКР «Нивелир-ЗУ»)
Поставка ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение омплектования ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»
Изготовление и поставка модулей ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»
ОКР - опытно-конструкторские работы
КА is the abbreviation for satellite.

‘Nivelir-ZU’ is the name of the work, not the satellite?

In 2014:-
Quote
Поставка модулей ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ в обеспечение комплектования ОКР «Нивелир-Л-ЗУ»
Поставка ЭРИ ОП и ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ ОКР «Нивелир»
Поставка ЭРИ ИП в обеспечение комплектования ЗУ для ЭО КА «Напряжение»

From 2015:-
Quote
Модули ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ для изделия КА 14Ф155
Поставка модулей ХП-М, ЗУ, ЦСВВ для образца технологического блока ЗУ для стенда КА 14Ф150

Progress procurement plans can be found here:-
http://www.samspace.ru/zakupki/plany_zakupok/

Further indication Nivelir-L and Napryazhenie-L are different satellites:-
Quote
1.3. В целях расширения рынка сбыта выпускаемых приборов проводится согласование
протоколов разрешённого применения на применение приборов на КА «Спектр-РГ», «Нивелир-Л», «Напряжение-Л», «Резонанс», 14Ф01.
http://www.geofizika-cosmos.ru/assets/files/otchyotnost/godovoj-otchet-2013.pdf

Just to confirm Mr. Pillet’s information that 14Ф150 was a payload for a Soyuz rocket, comes from TSENKI procurement plan of 2015:-
Quote
Дооборудование СК 17П32-С4 под КА 14Ф150
http://www.zakupki.gov.ru/223/plan/public/download/download.html?id=1677613 http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=26990.msg1339253#msg1339253

Also possibly the connection with Lavochkin can be found from this entry in Progress procurement plan:-
Quote
Изготовление и поставка модулей ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ для аппаратуры МКА-ФКИ

As to its function, the only piece of information is this:-
Quote
4 ЦНИИ МО РФ совместно с кооперацией подготовлена и представлена заказчику тематическая карточка на проведение базовой НИР «Нивелир-П» в 2014- 2015 годы «Комплексные исследования путей создания многоярусной космиче- ской системы мониторинга геодезических параметров Земли в интересах обеспечения стратегических сил и высокоточного оружия. Экспериментальная отработка ключевых элементов системы».
http://www.glonass-center.ru/aboutIAC/Report%20by%20Kosenko%20Zvonar_3.pdf

Is it possible there are two Nivelir projects?
yes.
Nivelir-ZU (RKTs Progress with NPO Lavochkin) and Nivelir-MNK-OZS (ISS Reshetnev) are the two known projects at this time although a third project via RKK Energia is hinted in documentation from time to time.
http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
« Last Edit: 06/25/2017 04:19 PM by russianhalo117 »

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #56 on: 06/25/2017 05:06 PM »
http://www.glonass-center.ru/aboutIAC/Report%20by%20Kosenko%20Zvonar_3.pdf
Is it possible there are two Nivelir projects?
yes.
Nivelir-ZU (RKTs Progress with NPO Lavochkin) and Nivelir-MNK-OZS (ISS Reshetnev) are the two known projects at this time although a third project via RKK Energia is hinted in documentation from time to time.
http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
Well, you would then talk about six projects, namely:
Nivelir
Nivelir-ZU
Nivelir-L
Nivelir-L-ZU
Nivelir-P
Nivelir-MNK-OZS.
It's too many for me -- I persume there is one or two main project(s) and a lot of subprojects, both listed above and still unknown.
Also, I absolutely don't see any relation between Nivelir-L and Napryazheniye-L projects other than NPP OPTEKS ordered some electronic components for both.


This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline zubenelgenubi

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #57 on: 06/25/2017 11:03 PM »
The NK-33A engine on this launch didn't blow up.

Would it be correct to say that the refurbishments on these old NK-33's appear to have been more successful than Aerojet's modifications of the engines purchased from the same stock to create their AJ-26's?

Or is it too soon/too small a sample to draw definitive conclusions?
« Last Edit: 06/25/2017 11:04 PM by zubenelgenubi »
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Online edkyle99

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #58 on: 06/26/2017 03:15 AM »
The NK-33A engine on this launch didn't blow up.

Would it be correct to say that the refurbishments on these old NK-33's appear to have been more successful than Aerojet's modifications of the engines purchased from the same stock to create their AJ-26's?

Or is it too soon/too small a sample to draw definitive conclusions?
NK-33/AJ-26 didn't blow up during the first four Antares launches either, so too soon to say.

 - Ed Kyle

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #59 on: 06/26/2017 10:38 AM »
Kosmos 2519 98.05 97.97 654 669
Resurs-O1     98.05 97.98 661 663 (launched 4.11.1994)
Almost the same orbit ...
Could it be optical reconnaissance?

Offline Kosmos2001

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #60 on: 06/26/2017 01:09 PM »
Anatoly Zak just posted something as interesting as worrying:

Fueling crew had to literally run from the pad, after a knife-edge countdown of #Soyuz-2-1v rocket Friday. DETAILS: http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html#prelaunch
Source: Anatoly's Zak twitter

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #61 on: 06/26/2017 01:13 PM »
According to latest TLE, Volga hasn't been deorbited, it was still in a 660 km/98° orbit this morning

Online edkyle99

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #62 on: 06/26/2017 01:23 PM »
According to latest TLE, Volga hasn't been deorbited, it was still in a 660 km/98° orbit this morning
Anatoly Zak reports that "according to the telemetry received by ground controllers, the breaking maneuver of the Volga space tug was performed at scheduled time at the end of the mission. The data also showed that the Volga successfully received a command to deactivate all systems aboard the stage, Russian industry sources said."

Could it be two satellites and Volga in the elliptical orbit?

 - Ed Kyle

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #63 on: 06/26/2017 01:28 PM »
According to latest TLE, Volga hasn't been deorbited, it was still in a 660 km/98° orbit this morning
Anatoly Zak reports that "according to the telemetry received by ground controllers, the breaking maneuver of the Volga space tug was performed at scheduled time at the end of the mission. The data also showed that the Volga successfully received a command to deactivate all systems aboard the stage, Russian industry sources said."

Could it be two satellites and Volga in the elliptical orbit?

 - Ed Kyle
The object in elliptical orbit is the Soyuz-2.1V second stage.
The two objects in circular orbit should be two satellites or a satellite and an operational fragment provided the information is reliable on the successful Volga deorbit.
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Soyuz-2.1v - 23th June 2017
« Reply #64 on: 06/26/2017 01:42 PM »
quote Stan Black


"So article 14Ф150 is satellite «Nivelir-L»?

Maybe it is a double satellite, №1 and №2?"

The thought was already there...
« Last Edit: 06/26/2017 01:45 PM by Alter Sachse »

Offline gosnold

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #65 on: 06/26/2017 06:01 PM »
Kosmos 2519 98.05 97.97 654 669
Resurs-O1     98.05 97.98 661 663 (launched 4.11.1994)
Almost the same orbit ...
Could it be optical reconnaissance?

Local time of the Descending node is 10:00 am solar, so it's certainly a possibility. In fact, it seems to be a replacement of Persona 2:

K2519 is almost in plane with 2013-028A. Don't know if this is intentional or not.
That was Kosmos 2486 ("Persona 2")
98.30° 99.76 min 714 km 733 km


Offline Stan Black

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #66 on: 06/26/2017 06:28 PM »
In my ineducated opinion, ХП-М, ЦСВВ, ЗУ modules are some low-level electronic components within ЗУ block which probably means запоминающее устройство (memory unit) and as such exists in different configurations within many spacecraft and ground support equipment items.
So it doesn't make sense to think that Nivelir-ZU may be a spacecraft name or a project name. Judging from the quotes above, it can me a name for a very small work of the larger Nivelir project. And NPP OPTEKS (Being a subsidiary of RKTs Progress) orders this ЗУ block to use in a larger assembly (maybe onboard computer or control system) to be delivered to a producer of a spacecraft.

I am trying to understand what are ХП-М and ЦСВВ. They are also connected with Lavochkin’s MKA-FKI based satellites? There is also a link between Lavochkin and the 14Ф150.
http://www.zakupki.gov.ru/223/purchase/public/purchase/info/common-info.html?noticeId=273020

Also what version of MKA-FKI was to be used for remote sensing in this attachment?
http://www.unoosa.org/pdf/pres/stsc2012/2012ind-06E.pdf
 - note the picture of Persona in that attachment?

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #67 on: 06/26/2017 08:11 PM »
Also what version of MKA-FKI was to be used for remote sensing in this attachment?
http://www.unoosa.org/pdf/pres/stsc2012/2012ind-06E.pdf
 - note the picture of Persona in that attachment?

The first MKA-FKI, launched on 22 July 2012, was a remote sensing satellite (also known as Zond-PP).

I think the satellite on the last page is the same one shown on the first page : Resurs-DK with the Pamela payload mounted on top.

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #68 on: 06/26/2017 08:28 PM »
There is also a link between Lavochkin and the 14Ф150.
http://www.zakupki.gov.ru/223/purchase/public/purchase/info/common-info.html?noticeId=273020
Not only a link but the proof 14Ф150 is/was being assembled and tested at Lavockin (just converted to a joint stock company AO NPO Lavochkin BTW). But there is another question: how do we know that K2519 is 14Ф150?
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #69 on: 06/26/2017 09:24 PM »
There is also a link between Lavochkin and the 14Ф150.
http://www.zakupki.gov.ru/223/purchase/public/purchase/info/common-info.html?noticeId=273020
Not only a link but the proof 14Ф150 is/was being assembled and tested at Lavockin (just converted to a joint stock company AO NPO Lavochkin BTW). But there is another question: how do we know that K2519 is 14Ф150?


Several tenuous things:-
Mr. Pillet identified it.
It was identified in procurement plans from TsENKI as a Soyuz payload. All others are accounted for?
The tender for insurance covering transportation of the rocket did not identify the payload, unlike for 2/138 which was for Kanopus.

Offline Nicolas PILLET

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #70 on: 06/26/2017 09:53 PM »
Mr. Pillet identified it.

No, I've never identified Cosmos-2519 as being 14F150.

All that I know is that in the Soyuz launch planning that I published about two years ago, there was "14F150 n°2" listed on a Soyuz-2.1v.

But this was a long time ago, many things may have changed in the plan. I have absolutely no element showing that Cosmos-2519 is 14F150.
Nicolas PILLET
Kosmonavtika : The French site on Russian Space

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #71 on: 06/26/2017 10:15 PM »
Unless I’ve missed something, the evidence from the procurement documents that links Nivelir/Napryazhenie/14F150  to this launch looks rather flimsy.

1) there is no clear evidence from the documents that Nivelir and Napryazhenie are part of one and the same project. The names themselves are not suggestive of a related mission either (although I fully realize we shouldn’t read too much into Russian satellite names). Nivelir means “dumpy level” (logical for a geodetic satellite) and Napryazhenie, translated by Anatoly Zak as “voltage”, is actually more often used in the meaning “tension” (including the figurative meanings “nervous feeling” or “no trust”).

2) Nivelir is confirmed in one of the documents to be a geodetic project, but the Sun-synchronous orbit used by Kosmos-2519 is not indicative of a geodetic mission.

3) One of the documents links the designator 14F150 to Nivelir and another says one of the Soyuz launch pads (17P32-S4) at Plesetsk was to be modified for 14F150, confirming that 14F150 is to be launched by a Soyuz-type rocket (although not necessarily the Soyuz-2.1v). Apparently, the reasoning was that Kosmos-2519 is most likely 14F150 (Nivelir) because that is the only Soyuz-launched classified military payload identified in the procurement documents that had not yet been launched. But, as I just mentioned, it doesn’t like Kosmos-2519 is on a geodetic mission…

So, unless Anatoly Zak has inside information that we don’t know about, what evidence is left that Kosmos-2519 is  14F150/Nivelir/Napryazhenie?

Let’s not forget that this is what the Ministry of Defense has officially said about the payload

http://tass.ru/kosmos/4362793

"The satellite is a space platform on which several types of payloads can be installed. The payload [for this mission] is equipment for remote sensing of the Earth and equipment to photograph objects in space".

It seems hard to combine both of those functions on one and the same satellite (especially a relatively small one like this), but the orbital behaviour of Kosmos-2519 does seem to indicate that both missions are plausible.
The Sun-synchronous orbit is suggestive of a remote sensing mission and the fact that Kosmos-2519 in the same orbital plane as Kosmos-2486/Persona-2  may mean that (for whatever reason) it may perform a  rendezvous with that satellite. If a second (unannounced) satellite is indeed involved, one could be on a remote sensing mission, the other on an inspection mission. This, of course, brings back memories of the mysterious payloads (Kosmos-2491, 2499, 2504) launched piggyback on three Rokot missions in 2013-2015 that were reportedly also on simulated inspection missions and the first two of which were not announced after launch.

It will be interesting to see the coming days if Kosmos-2519 gets any closer to Kosmos-2486. I'm not sure if this is always up to date, but you can track the position of both satellites on n2yo.com. 
 
The Ministry of Defence press release also says the satellite uses a platform (bus) that can be used for other payloads. This could be a completely new, unidentified bus, but it might just as well be a known bus. Any speculation what that might be? The MSS bus used by Bars-M looks too heavy (Soyuz-2.1v can launch just 1,400 kg into SSO and Bars-M weighs about 4 tons).  One possible candidate that comes to mind is the bus that PO Polyot built for the military Kanopus-ST remote sensing satellite (lost on the first Soyuz-2-1v launch in 2015), but there are probably other candidates as well.

Offline apachhi

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #72 on: 06/27/2017 06:52 AM »
Closer to Kosmos 2519 (2017-037A)  with APRIZESAT 5 (2011-044E), 27.06.2017, 09:37:02 UTC, 593 m.

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #73 on: 06/27/2017 08:16 AM »
Closer to Kosmos 2519 (2017-037A)  with APRIZESAT 5 (2011-044E), 27.06.2017, 09:37:02 UTC, 593 m.
Close enough to take a good picture ;D

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #74 on: 06/27/2017 10:41 AM »
Closer to Kosmos 2519 (2017-037A)  with APRIZESAT 5 (2011-044E), 27.06.2017, 09:37:02 UTC, 593 m.
Close enough to take a good picture ;D
Now I understand reply #36
"The payload is equipment for remote sensing of the Earth and equipment to photograph objects in space" :) :)

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #75 on: 06/27/2017 01:40 PM »
Isn't it fun to have something that's unexplained and secret again?   Just like the "good old days" before perestroyka and glasnost. :)

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #76 on: 06/27/2017 02:22 PM »
Isn't it fun to have something that's unexplained and secret again?   Just like the "good old days" before perestroyka and glasnost. :)
We move backwards... :(

Offline Nicolas PILLET

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #77 on: 06/27/2017 02:47 PM »
Isn't it fun to have something that's unexplained and secret again?   Just like the "good old days" before perestroyka and glasnost. :)

Maybe in forty years, there will be a full-scale mock-up of Cosmos-2519 in the Moscow Memorial Museum of Cosmonautics, and it will be very funny to compare the informations with this thread... :D
Nicolas PILLET
Kosmonavtika : The French site on Russian Space

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #78 on: 06/27/2017 02:57 PM »
Isn't it fun to have something that's unexplained and secret again?   Just like the "good old days" before perestroyka and glasnost. :)
Maybe in forty years, there will be a full-scale mock-up of Cosmos-2519 in the Moscow Memorial Museum of Cosmonautics, and it will be very funny to compare the informations with this thread... :D

Ah, the nostalgia for the days when one new rocket engine would be revealed and we could design whole new launchers around it!   These days people can't imagine the fun that we old-timers had in the early 1980s and earlier.

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #79 on: 06/27/2017 04:00 PM »
I wonder if the connection between Nivelir and the geodesy mission is the Karat-200 platform/bus from Lavochkin?

Offline Stan Black

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #80 on: 06/27/2017 04:09 PM »
http://www.glonass-center.ru/aboutIAC/Report%20by%20Kosenko%20Zvonar_3.pdf
Is it possible there are two Nivelir projects?
yes.
Nivelir-ZU (RKTs Progress with NPO Lavochkin) and Nivelir-MNK-OZS (ISS Reshetnev) are the two known projects at this time although a third project via RKK Energia is hinted in documentation from time to time.
http://russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html
Well, you would then talk about six projects, namely:
Nivelir
Nivelir-ZU
Nivelir-L
Nivelir-L-ZU
Nivelir-P
Nivelir-MNK-OZS.
It's too many for me -- I persume there is one or two main project(s) and a lot of subprojects, both listed above and still unknown.
Also, I absolutely don't see any relation between Nivelir-L and Napryazheniye-L projects other than NPP OPTEKS ordered some electronic components for both.

Quote
НОУ УНПК МФТИ является соисполнителем 2 научно-исследовательских ра-бот, выполняемых МФТИ (шифр «Нивелир» и «Напряжение», общий объем кото-рых составляет 13 500 тыс. руб.)

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #81 on: 06/27/2017 09:39 PM »
As to its function, the only piece of information is this:-
Quote
4 ЦНИИ МО РФ совместно с кооперацией подготовлена и представлена заказчику тематическая карточка на проведение базовой НИР «Нивелир-П» в 2014- 2015 годы «Комплексные исследования путей создания многоярусной космиче- ской системы мониторинга геодезических параметров Земли в интересах обеспечения стратегических сил и высокоточного оружия. Экспериментальная отработка ключевых элементов системы».
http://www.glonass-center.ru/aboutIAC/Report%20by%20Kosenko%20Zvonar_3.pdf

Is it possible there are two Nivelir projects?

Speaking of this 2013 presentation, AO ISS has proposed three-part geodetic system with one or two GEO-IK3 spacecraft at 1000 km, a couple of GRACE type satelites at 500 km and one GOCE type satellite with gradientometer at 250-300 km. Neither of these was to be launched before the end of 2018 to a 650 km orbit.
« Last Edit: 06/27/2017 09:41 PM by Liss »
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #82 on: 07/01/2017 09:15 PM »
Current tracking data (for instance via n2yo.com) shows Cosmos-2519 trailing Cosmos-2486 (Persona-2) by just a couple of minutes. Being in a slightly lower orbit, Cosmos-2519 should soon overtake it. 

On 27 June there was a close pass (593 m) between Cosmos-2519 and APRIZESAT 5 (2011-044E) (as reported in this thread in Reply #73). I'm not sure if the mutual velocity of the satellites would have allowed Cosmos-2519 to snap any pictures of it, but isn't this looking more and more like some type of inspection mission? 

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #83 on: 07/01/2017 10:33 PM »
Current tracking data (for instance via n2yo.com) shows Cosmos-2519 trailing Cosmos-2486 (Persona-2) by just a couple of minutes. Being in a slightly lower orbit, Cosmos-2519 should soon overtake it. 

On 27 June there was a close pass (593 m) between Cosmos-2519 and APRIZESAT 5 (2011-044E) (as reported in this thread in Reply #73). I'm not sure if the mutual velocity of the satellites would have allowed Cosmos-2519 to snap any pictures of it, but isn't this looking more and more like some type of inspection mission?
We must observe whether Cosmos 2519 changes its orbit.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #84 on: 07/13/2017 03:50 AM »
I see no connection between the Cosmos 2519 satellite and the second Kvarts/Persona-1 mission, Cosmos 2486.

All three of the Kvarts satellites are in orbits above 700 km, while Cosmos 2519 has remained in a 653-670 km orbit (+/-1 km), with no sign of an orbital manoeuvre.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #85 on: 08/09/2017 10:25 AM »
I have just been doing my monthly check on certain satellites that I am monitoring in some detail and I have noted that Cosmos 2519 has manoeuvred.

The initial orbit from the TLEs was 98.05 deg, 97.97 minutes, 654-669 km.

By July 26 the altitude had evolved to 652-671 km (maybe some tiny manoeuvres during the intervening period or maybe orbital eccentricity inaccuracies in the TLEs) and on July 27 it was tracked in a 650-671 km orbit.

During August 1-3 the orbit dropped from 651-671 km to 649-669 km.   This also saw a small change in the orbital inclination, from 98.04 deg to 97.98 deg: on August 4 there was a further inclination change to 97.94 deg.

No further manoeuvres can be detected with confidence from the TLE data to date.
« Last Edit: 08/09/2017 10:31 AM by Phillip Clark »

Offline Danderman

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #86 on: 08/10/2017 07:15 AM »
The last "maneuver" is consistent with natural decay, as well as imprecision in tracking.

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #87 on: 08/10/2017 07:49 AM »
The last "maneuver" is consistent with natural decay, as well as imprecision in tracking.
I don't think so. Changes in mean height and inclination are intentional and easily seen in graphs.

« Last Edit: 08/10/2017 07:51 AM by Liss »
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #88 on: 08/10/2017 08:57 AM »
The attached Excel spreadsheet is my own version of Igor's graphs.   Interesting that while the orbital period originally remained almost constant, apogee slowly increased and perigee slowly decreased before the manoeuvres started: of course, this could be an artifact of the TLEs homing in on the correct eccentricity, the orbital parameter which is always difficult to determine for near-circular orbits.   In any case, these graphs clearly show where there were manoeuvres and where there was natural orbital evolution.

Offline Danderman

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #89 on: 08/10/2017 03:56 PM »
Actually, it looks the opposite to me; it looks like the spacecraft was actively maintaining its orbit until about Aug 3, and then stop doing so, allowing natural decay to slowly reduce apogee.

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #90 on: 08/10/2017 04:01 PM »
Actually, it looks the opposite to me; it looks like the spacecraft was actively maintaining its orbit until about Aug 3, and then stop doing so, allowing natural decay to slowly reduce apogee.
Can you explain changes in inclination too?
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #91 on: 08/10/2017 04:50 PM »
At this level the orbit is stable for an extended period of time.
I think the changes are "maneuvers"

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #92 on: 08/10/2017 05:04 PM »
At this level the orbit is stable for an extended period of time.
I think the changes are "maneuvers"

Also, manoeuvres are indicated by discontinuities in the graph data, while natural evolution results in smooth, continuous curves.

Offline Magic

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #93 on: 08/12/2017 04:21 AM »
Satellite Digest - 536 listing of Kosmos 2519  note 35: "...would appear to be equivalent of the US SBSS satellite."
Spaceflight Vol60 September 2017 p.346
« Last Edit: 08/12/2017 06:06 PM by Magic »

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #94 on: 08/12/2017 05:12 AM »
Satellite Digest note 35: "...would appear to be equivalent of the US SBSS satellite."
Spaceflight Vol60 September 2017 p.346
The sun-synchronous orbit is suitable for this

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #95 on: 08/13/2017 12:25 AM »
Satellite Digest - 536 listing of Kosmos 2519  note 35: "...would appear to be equivalent of the US SBSS satellite."
Spaceflight Vol60 September 2017 p.346

That assessment is probably based on what the Russian Ministry of Defence has officially said about the satellite:

http://tass.ru/kosmos/4362793

"The satellite is a space platform on which several types of payloads can be installed. The payload installed on the platform is equipment for remote sensing of the Earth and equipment to photograph objects in space".

So are there any indications that Russia has been working on a space-based space surveillance system? There is some evidence that a satellite launched on 2 August 1994 (Cosmos-2285, also identified as Obzor) tested equipment for space surveillance. It carried a multispectral camera called KOE-OZ built by NPP OPTEKS, which was described on the company's website as having been designed for "remote sensing of the Earth's surface and atmosphere as well as near space" (as quoted in an article in "Novosti kosmonavtiki" 10/2002).

One publication identified the satellite as 17F118-0, indicating it used the same bus as the 17F118 Nadezhda navigation satellites built by PO Polyot in Omsk.
http://www.dslib.net/texnika/radiometricheskaja-i-radiacionnaja-korrekcija-informacii-poluchaemoj-optiko.html

Cosmos-2285 used the same launch vehicle (Cosmos-3M) and orbital altitude (roughly 1000 km) as Nadezhda, but had a different inclination (74° vs 83° for Nadezhda). It remained operational for five years.
https://en.sovzond.ru/upload/iblock/ec9/2010_04_004.pdf

In late 2001 a clue emerged that Cosmos-2285 might have been the experimental precursor of an operational constellation of satellites. A document appeared on the website of the State Committee for Radio Frequencies about the allocation of radio frequencies for a satellite constellation called "Stroi". This was said to be intended to "provide the Ministry of Defense with information about the space situation". The constellation was to consist of 3 to 9 small Stroi-KS satellites in three orbital planes and in circular orbits (at 650 to 1000 km altitude) with an inclination of 74°. Stroi-KS was said to have been preceded by an experimental system called Stroi-EK (possibly Cosmos-2285).
http://dokipedia.ru/document/5278810

Interestingly, when former OPTEKS director Vladimir Karasev died in 2010, a press release said that "the space-based space surveillance system Stroi-Obzor" had been developed under his leadership.
http://www.netall.ru/gnn/130/573/437561.html

None of the Stroi satellites were ever launched and there are no indications that the project is still alive. If Cosmos-2519 is used for space surveillance, it is probably an entirely different satellite.

One clue that Russia is still interested in such satellites came in a March 2013 interview between Interfax and Viktor Shilin, chief designer of the MAK Vympel corporation, which is closely involved in the development of Russia's ground-based space surveillance systems. Asked how he expected America's space-based space surveillance systems to evolve, he said: "We think that we will also have such space-based optical instruments as well as inspector satellites. Optical imaging satellites [like that] can have a mass of 300 to 400 kg, such plans exist".
http://www.militarynews.ru/story.asp?rid=2&nid=327466

That, of course, doesn't mean such a satellite was actually built in a few years time. I do wonder though (but it's sheer speculation) if there is a link between Cosmos-2519 and the Kanopus-ST satellite (Cosmos-2511), launched on 5 December 2015 (but rendered useless when it failed to separate from the launch vehicle). Kanopus-ST was a 440 kg satellite for remote sensing in the interests of the Ministry of Defence (the exact purpose was never clearly identified). It was launched into an orbit similar to Cosmos-2519 (roughly 700 km, 98.1°) and used the same launch vehicle (Soyuz-2-1v/Volga). It had a bus built by PO Polyot and the company responsible for the payload and the project as a whole was NTTs Kosmonit. The payload consisted of a microwave radiometer and a multispectral camera called KMVD-E.

Could Cosmos-2519 have the same bus with a different or related payload?  Admittedly, I have seen no evidence that PO Polyot (now part of Khrunichev) is still in the satellite building business (their primary task is to organize the serial manufacturе of the Angara rocket). Moreover, the development of Kanopus-ST was very troublesome and ran into many delays.

As for the payload, it is interesting to note that NTTs Kosmonit is not only involved in Earth remote sensing, but also in modeling of the space debris environment.
http://resurs.cpi.space.ru
But claiming that it may therefore also be involved in developing a space surveillance payload is a big stretch of the imagination...
 

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #96 on: 08/13/2017 08:49 AM »
other "Obzor"-projects:
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/obzor_o.html
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/obzor_r.html
 
quote Obzor O-article:
"The satellites were expected to operate in a 700-kilometer circular orbit with an inclination 98.2 degrees toward the Equator."

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #97 on: 08/13/2017 11:35 AM »
other "Obzor"-projects:
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/obzor_o.html
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/obzor_r.html
 
quote Obzor O-article:
"The satellites were expected to operate in a 700-kilometer circular orbit with an inclination 98.2 degrees toward the Equator."

These are unrelated to Stroi-Obzor.

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #98 on: 08/23/2017 01:50 PM »
Interfax reported today http://www.interfax.ru/russia/576068 that an inspector satellite has separated today from Kosmos-2519 to conduct experiments with imaging the main spacecraft.
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #99 on: 08/23/2017 02:10 PM »
Fascinating, Igor!

Offline Nicolas PILLET

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #100 on: 08/23/2017 04:29 PM »
The original source is this press release from Ministry of Defense :

http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139523@egNews
Nicolas PILLET
Kosmonavtika : The French site on Russian Space

Offline Magic

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #101 on: 08/23/2017 06:06 PM »
2017-037D?

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #102 on: 08/23/2017 06:33 PM »
2017-037D?

One would assume so.   As of now there are now TLEs of the new object.
« Last Edit: 08/24/2017 12:46 AM by Phillip Clark »

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #103 on: 08/23/2017 08:37 PM »
Interfax reported today http://www.interfax.ru/russia/576068 that an inspector satellite has separated today from Kosmos-2519 to conduct experiments with imaging the main spacecraft.
A significant amendment: the inspector is said to image another, unnamed Russian spaceraft.
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #104 on: 08/23/2017 09:57 PM »
Interesting enough that current difference in height with K2486 (55 km) is compensated with difference in inclination (0.21°).

« Last Edit: 08/23/2017 09:57 PM by Liss »
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #105 on: 08/24/2017 07:34 AM »
This, of course, brings back memories of the mysterious payloads (Kosmos-2491, 2499, 2504) launched piggyback on three Rokot missions in 2013-2015 that were reportedly also on simulated inspection missions and the first two of which were not announced after launch. The last two rendezvoused with the Briz-KM upper stage that placed them into orbit. The subsatellite released yesterday may have the same design.

Yesterday's Ministry of Defense report also explains the seemingly conflicting missions announced for Cosmos-2519 earlier ("remote sensing" and "observing satellites"). The "mother satellite" should then be on a (military) remote sensing mission and the subsatellite on an inspection mission. The question remains then what type of reconnaissance satellite this is and whether it uses an existing bus or a new one.

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #106 on: 08/24/2017 10:28 AM »
"Inspector" has now been cataloged as Object D

2017-037D/42919 in 650 x 670 km x 97.92° (epoch Aug 23 22:17:10 UTC)

while Cosmos 2519 (Object A) was in
2017-037A/42798 in 649 x 668 km x 97.92° (epoch Aug 23, 22:16:59 UTC)

Argument of latitude of "Inspector" was 360.2587°
while argument of latitude of Cosmos 2519 was 360.2881°

Offline Alter Sachse

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Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #108 on: 08/24/2017 02:32 PM »
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html#orbit

I find Anatoly's piece puzzling in many ways.

First, object 37B was de-orbited on June 26, so how could it manoeuvre on July 26?

Second, I read the Russian announcement that Cosmos 2519 = 37A is the "platform" from which the inspector was deployed.

Thirdly, there is no sign that any object from the Cosmos 2519 launch ever came close to reaching the same orbital altitude as Cosmos 2486, either at the beginning of August or at any other time so how could an object have "approached" Cosmos 2486?
« Last Edit: 08/24/2017 03:50 PM by Phillip Clark »

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #109 on: 08/24/2017 02:55 PM »
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html#orbit

I find Anatoly's piece puzzling in many ways.

First, object 37B was de-orbited on June 26, so how could it manoeivre on July 26?

Second, I read the Russian announcement that Cosmos 2519 = 37A is the "platform" from which the inspector was deployed.

Thirdly, there is no sign that any object from the Cosmos 2519 launch ever came close to reaching the same orbital altitude as Cosmos 2486, either at the beginning of August or at any other time so how could an object have "approached" Cosmos 2486?
Yes, according to NORAD data, Volga , cataloged as 2017-037B, reentered on June 27, latest available TLE corresponds to an epoch of June 26. So we wonder about the July 26 maneuver...
I think Anatoly should update his webpage taking into account the confirmed appearance of Object D, 2017-037D 

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #110 on: 08/24/2017 04:44 PM »
The maneuvers (26.07.) may concern object A ?
I think it is possible that the "inspector" Cosmos 2486 will approach.
« Last Edit: 08/24/2017 04:51 PM by Alter Sachse »

Offline Danderman

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #111 on: 08/24/2017 04:50 PM »
I am not suggesting this based on any facts, but don't rule out the maneuvers being conducted by the Volga platform, somehow still being in orbit. Or rather, that possibility should be ruled out.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #112 on: 08/24/2017 04:59 PM »
The maneuvers (26.07.) may concern object A ?
I think it is possible that the "inspector" Cosmos 2486 will approach.

My comments are based upon what Anatoly Zak's referenced piece actually says and he says that C2519 approached C2486 at the start of this month.   And he specifically says that the July 26+ mannoeuvres were by object B from the launch.

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #113 on: 08/24/2017 06:35 PM »
http://www.russianspaceweb.com/napryazhenie.html#orbit
Thirdly, there is no sign that any object from the Cosmos 2519 launch ever came close to reaching the same orbital altitude as Cosmos 2486, either at the beginning of August or at any other time so how could an object have "approached" Cosmos 2486?
I think Anatoly failed to correctly interpret my plot which does show "approach" in the first days of August, but in plane only, not in height yet.
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #114 on: 08/27/2017 08:29 AM »
A post on the NK forum yesterday suggests Cosmos-2519 is a product of NPO Lavochkin. There was apparently some kind of internal message sent to the NPO Lavochkin workforce on "the successful completion of the first stage of flight tests" of Cosmos-2519 (which I assume is the phase before the release of the subsatellite). The poster also claims the satellite was built in barely two years time. I don't know if this person is a Lavochkin insider, but interesting to mention here nevertheless.

We can't tell for sure if Lavochkin built the main satellite or the subsatellite (or both), but let's assume it's the main satellite. We know from the Ministry of Defense announcement made shortly after launch that the satellite uses a bus that can house a variety of payloads. NPO Lavochkin has produced two satellite buses, namely Navigator and Karat. Navigator is the bus used by the Elektro-L geostationary weather satellites and the Radioastron/Spektr-R observatory (as well as future satellites in the Spektr series). Karat has been used by two small scientific satellites (MKA-FKI PN1/Zond-PP and MKA-FKI-PN2/Relek), both of which failed well before the end of their expected lifetimes.

https://www.laspace.ru/company/products/platforms/Navigator   

Navigator : platform mass 850-980 kg, maximum fuel load 570 kg, maximum payload mass 2600 kg
Karat : maximum platform mass 140 kg, maximum payload mass 100 kg.   

Neither would seem to fit the bill. Soyuz-2.1v can deliver a maximum of 1.4 t to Sun-synchronous orbit from Plesetsk (according to Roscosmos data). That would seem to leave too little payload capacity for Cosmos-2519 if it were to use a Navigator bus. Karat is a small platform (both MKA-FKI satellites were launched piggyback) and it seems to have been abandoned following its two problem-plagued missions.

Lavochkin has been working on a new bus called Karat-200, which was selected for a solar observatory last year.  Maximum bus weight is said to be 246 kg. Also seems to be too small. Having said that, if they want to put 300/400 kg  class satellites into SSO from Plesetsk without them hitching a ride with other satellites, they have no other options than Soyuz-2.1v or Rokot. There's nothing smaller around. For instance, the Kanopus-ST satellite launched into the same kind of orbit by a Soyuz-2.1v/Volga in 2015 weighed just 440 kg. And if Kosmos-2519 was indeed built in just two years, you would expect them to have used an existing bus rather than something totally new... 

 

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #115 on: 08/27/2017 01:12 PM »
For the record, here is tentatively a NOTAM for Volga debris impact zone valid until June 24, 07:10 UTC
(to be compared with similar NOTAM for the previous Soyuz 2.1v launch)
Question: why then was object 2017-037B, identified by USSTRATCOM as Volga, tracked until June 26 in a 654 x 669 km orbit?

B2912/17 NOTAMN
Q) NZZO/QRTCA/IV/BO /W /000/999/4500S15329W999
A) NZZO B) 1706231800 C) 1706240710
E) TEMPO DANGER AREA NZD030 (EAST AUCKLAND OCEANIC FIR) IS PRESCRIBED
AS FLW:
ALL THAT AIRSPACE BOUNDED BY A LINE JOINING
S 30 00 00, W 131 00 00
S 60 00 00, W 131 00 00
S 60 00 00, W 175 00 00
S 30 00 00, W 175 00 00
S 30 00 00, W 131 00 00.
ACTIVITY: SPACE DEBRIS RETURN
USER AGENCY: FOREIGN SPACE AGENCY
PRESCRIBED PURSUANT TO CIVIL AVIATION RULE PART 71 UNDER A DELEGATED
AUTHORITY ISSUED BY THE DIRECTOR OF CIVIL AVIATION
F) SFC G) FL999

Offline anik

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #116 on: 08/27/2017 01:26 PM »
For the record, here is tentatively a NOTAM for Volga debris impact zone valid until June 24, 07:10 UTC
(to be compared with similar NOTAM for the previous Soyuz 2.1v launch)
Question: why then was object 2017-037B, identified by USSTRATCOM as Volga, tracked until June 26 in a 654 x 669 km orbit?

At last this question is asked.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #117 on: 08/27/2017 02:20 PM »
For the record, here is tentatively a NOTAM for Volga debris impact zone valid until June 24, 07:10 UTC
(to be compared with similar NOTAM for the previous Soyuz 2.1v launch)
Question: why then was object 2017-037B, identified by USSTRATCOM as Volga, tracked until June 26 in a 654 x 669 km orbit?
At last this question is asked.

I know that in the past (and I started to get the TLEs in 1980) we would sometimes get post-decay element sets for objects when USSTRATCOM or its earlier equivalent would issue *predicted* orbital data for an object because the computer system had not registered the decay/re-entry.   Could this have happened with the Volga stage?

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #118 on: 08/27/2017 03:11 PM »
another possibility:Volga stage is burn up
and the tracked object is another part of this launch

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #119 on: 08/27/2017 07:24 PM »
From Spacetrack: ???

 
NORAD CAT IDSATNAMEINTLDESDECAY_EPOCHRCSSOURCEType
42799VOLGA R/B2017-037B27/06/2017 00:00LARGEsatcatHistorical
« Last Edit: 08/27/2017 08:34 PM by input~2 »

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #120 on: 08/27/2017 08:18 PM »
Any new orbital data of object "D" ?

Offline input~2

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #121 on: 08/27/2017 08:32 PM »
Any new orbital data of object "D" ?
Slight change: initial period of 97.93 min was 97.92 min last night

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #122 on: 08/27/2017 08:58 PM »
Any new orbital data of object "D" ?
Slight change: initial period of 97.93 min was 97.92 min last night

You need to ask "is that change in the orbital period "real" or due to inherent errors of the TLEs?".

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #123 on: 08/27/2017 09:18 PM »
You need to ask "is that change in the orbital period "real" or due to inherent errors of the TLEs?".
I'd say it's real:

« Last Edit: 08/27/2017 09:18 PM by Liss »
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #124 on: 08/28/2017 08:36 AM »
During the period August 24-27 the orbital period of the subsatellite has had an overall reduction from 97.93 minutes to 97.89 minutes which I am happy is real.

I have also noted that during August 27 the orbital period of C2486 appears to have reduced from 99.07 minutes to 99.04 minutes.   It means that C2519 and/or the subsatellite still have a long way to go before they rendezvous with C2486 - if indeed that is the intention.   Maybe the Russians will be happy with long-distance observations?

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #125 on: 08/28/2017 09:01 AM »
During the period August 24-27 the orbital period of the subsatellite has had an overall reduction from 97.93 minutes to 97.89 minutes which I am happy is real.

I have also noted that during August 27 the orbital period of C2486 appears to have reduced from 99.07 minutes to 99.04 minutes.   It means that C2519 and/or the subsatellite still have a long way to go before they rendezvous with C2486 - if indeed that is the intention.   Maybe the Russians will be happy with long-distance observations?
The least distance is 30 km. Too much for good pictures ??

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #126 on: 08/28/2017 09:33 AM »
During the period August 24-27 the orbital period of the subsatellite has had an overall reduction from 97.93 minutes to 97.89 minutes which I am happy is real.
I have also noted that during August 27 the orbital period of C2486 appears to have reduced from 99.07 minutes to 99.04 minutes.   It means that C2519 and/or the subsatellite still have a long way to go before they rendezvous with C2486 - if indeed that is the intention.   Maybe the Russians will be happy with long-distance observations?
The least distance is 30 km. Too much for good pictures ??

I agree about the distance but if the technology is aimed at taking images of objects in orbit then being able to photograph distant objects would save on propellant!

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #127 on: 08/28/2017 11:45 AM »
During the period August 24-27 the orbital period of the subsatellite has had an overall reduction from 97.93 minutes to 97.89 minutes which I am happy is real.
I have also noted that during August 27 the orbital period of C2486 appears to have reduced from 99.07 minutes to 99.04 minutes.   It means that C2519 and/or the subsatellite still have a long way to go before they rendezvous with C2486 - if indeed that is the intention.   Maybe the Russians will be happy with long-distance observations?
The least distance is 30 km. Too much for good pictures ??

I agree about the distance but if the technology is aimed at taking images of objects in orbit then being able to photograph distant objects would save on propellant!
If the "inspector" is looking for the temporary failure of Cocmos 2486, he must be closer.

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #128 on: 08/28/2017 11:51 AM »
What temporary failure of Cosmos 2486?

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #129 on: 08/28/2017 11:56 AM »
What temporary failure of Cosmos 2486?
It should have failed from 11/2013 to 6/2014.

Offline gwiz

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #130 on: 08/28/2017 01:11 PM »
What temporary failure of Cosmos 2486?
Not many details, some sort of computer problem, functionality was restored with new software.

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #131 on: 08/28/2017 01:33 PM »
http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139523@egNews
If I understand the report correctly, the mother-satellite is to be observed.
 Or does it mean anyone "own satellite"?
« Last Edit: 08/28/2017 08:31 PM by Alter Sachse »

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #132 on: 08/28/2017 02:27 PM »
What temporary failure of Cosmos 2486?
Not many details, some sort of computer problem, functionality was restored with new software.

I was thinking that the failure being referred to was much more recent.

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #133 on: 08/28/2017 08:35 PM »
http://function.mil.ru/news_page/country/more.htm?id=12139523@egNews
If I understand the report correctly, the mother-satellite is to be observed.
 Or does it mean "own satellite"?

The adjective used ("otechestvennyy") is derived from the word "fatherland", "homeland" and is simply used as a synonym for "Russian". So it doesn't refer to the mother satellite. Here's a full translation of the report:

"On 23 June this year a satellite was launched from Plesetsk in the interests of the Russian Ministry of Defense. This satellite is a space platform on which various types of payloads can be installed. Today a small satellite was released from this platform which is intended to inspect the condition of a Russian satellite. A scientific experiment is planned to study the exterior of this satellite with the small satellite."

Note that the word which I have translated as "platform" is commonly used in Russian for a satellite bus, so it shouldn't necessarily be interpreted as a "launch platform".

Here is Spaceflight 101's analysis of recent events in the Cosmos-2519 mission:

http://spaceflight101.com/russian-inspector-satellite-orbital-activity/

Interesting to see in that report that the last two inspector satellites launched on the Rokot booster (Cosmos-2499 and 2504) have shown more activity in 2017, with the latter possibly passing within one km of a piece of Chinese space debris.



Offline Stan Black

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #134 on: 08/28/2017 09:30 PM »
During the period August 24-27 the orbital period of the subsatellite has had an overall reduction from 97.93 minutes to 97.89 minutes which I am happy is real.

I have also noted that during August 27 the orbital period of C2486 appears to have reduced from 99.07 minutes to 99.04 minutes.   It means that C2519 and/or the subsatellite still have a long way to go before they rendezvous with C2486 - if indeed that is the intention.   Maybe the Russians will be happy with long-distance observations?

There is an article here about long distance observations using Lavochkin satellites:-
http://www.laspace.ru/upload/iblock/fd1/fd1ace1832b2224dc012a18c14e2f6c7.pdf
http://vestnik.laspace.ru/archives/04-2015/
« Last Edit: 08/28/2017 09:30 PM by Stan Black »

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #135 on: 08/28/2017 10:08 PM »
During the period August 24-27 the orbital period of the subsatellite has had an overall reduction from 97.93 minutes to 97.89 minutes which I am happy is real.

I have also noted that during August 27 the orbital period of C2486 appears to have reduced from 99.07 minutes to 99.04 minutes.   It means that C2519 and/or the subsatellite still have a long way to go before they rendezvous with C2486 - if indeed that is the intention.   Maybe the Russians will be happy with long-distance observations?

There is an article here about long distance observations using Lavochkin satellites:-
http://www.laspace.ru/upload/iblock/fd1/fd1ace1832b2224dc012a18c14e2f6c7.pdf
http://vestnik.laspace.ru/archives/04-2015/

This article (published in a 2015 edition of the NPO Lavochkin magazine "Vestnik") describes two satellites for observations of the geostationary belt : one (using the Navigator bus) in a highly elliptical orbit for close-up observations and the other using the Karat-200 bus for long-distance observations. As I mentioned in a post yesterday, Cosmos-2519 was likely built by NPO Lavochkin and Karat-200 might be the bus. A drawing published in this article may well show what Cosmos-2519 looks like. It shows the bus + payload. We could assume then that Cosmos-2519 is the bus+payload to observe the geostationary belt and the subsatellite was attached to the top of that payload.

Amazing that the answer to many questions posed here may have been staring us in the face all the time...

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #136 on: 08/28/2017 10:52 PM »
A correction to my previous post : both satellites are described as being intended for placement into highly elliptical orbits. One (using the Karat-200 bus) would observe satellites from distances between 4000 and 18000 km and the other (using the Navigator bus) from distances between 100 and 400 km.

However, Cosmos-2519 could still be the Karat-200 type satellite doing its observations in Sun-synchronous orbit rather than in a highly elliptical orbit. 

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #137 on: 08/29/2017 06:58 AM »
Interesting to see in that report that the last two inspector satellites launched on the Rokot booster (Cosmos-2499 and 2504) have shown more activity in 2017, with the latter possibly passing within one km of a piece of Chinese space debris.
I'm quite sure that any close encounter with a piece of debris would be unintentional.
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #138 on: 09/09/2017 11:58 AM »
Is there any news about K2519 / Subsatellite?

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #139 on: 09/09/2017 07:15 PM »
Is there any news about K2519 / Subsatellite?
Judging from TLEs, the subsatellite stopped her drift at 600 km or so and returned to the vicinity of the mother satellite on September 4, having passed just below Kosmos 2519 early on September 6.
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #140 on: 09/13/2017 04:31 AM »
The inspector thing has started moving higher, if the latest TLE set is valid.
Upd: The elset was erroneous.
« Last Edit: 09/15/2017 07:52 AM by Liss »
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Online Galactic Penguin SST

http://novosti-kosmonavtiki.ru/news/34836/ reported that the "inspector satellite" that separated from Kosmos 2519 has been assigned as Kosmos 2521, leaving GLONASS-M #752 launched today as K-2522.
Chinese spaceflight is a cosmic riddle wrapped in a galactic mystery inside an orbital enigma... - (not) Winston Churchill

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #142 on: 09/24/2017 09:44 AM »
Now the child has a name: Kosmos 2521
23.09.:97.91° 97.91min 652/665 km

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #143 on: 10/20/2017 09:47 PM »
There are news about Kosmos 2521 ?

Offline Phillip Clark

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Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #145 on: 10/26/2017 03:59 PM »
New Russian report.

http://www.interfax.com/newsinf.asp?id=786439
What is the content ?
my laptop can not find it

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #146 on: 10/26/2017 04:16 PM »
New Russian report.
http://www.interfax.com/newsinf.asp?id=786439
What is the content ?
my laptop can not find it

Maybe the story has been taken down - the links to the piece do not seem to be working.   Apologies.   The story was simply saying that "The inspector satellite, coupled with the Kosmos-2519 platform, was launched on June 23. The satellite undocked from the platform, performed an autonomous flight, changed its orbit, conducted an inspection, and returned to base".

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #147 on: 10/26/2017 04:21 PM »
New Russian report.
http://www.interfax.com/newsinf.asp?id=786439
What is the content ?
my laptop can not find it

Maybe the story has been taken down - the links to the piece do not seem to be working.   Apologies.   The story was simply saying that "The inspector satellite, coupled with the Kosmos-2519 platform, was launched on June 23. The satellite undocked from the platform, performed an autonomous flight, changed its orbit, conducted an inspection, and returned to base".
Thank you !

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #148 on: 10/26/2017 04:28 PM »
I found this in NK-Forum:
http://www.militarynews.ru/story.asp?rid=1&nid=465067
Google translation:
Moscow. 26 October. Interfax - Russian space forces conducted a successful test of the satellite-inspector, who can fly to other orbital vehicles, the Izvestia newspaper wrote on Thursday.
       "During the tests to control the maneuvering military satellite, ground and orbital communications were tested, ballistic calculation methods and new software were tested," the newspaper reports referring to the Defense Ministry.
       It is noted that the Space Forces were also able to confirm the automatic separation of the satellite from the platform, the remote control of its flight, the use of on-board equipment, including surveillance equipment, as well as the transfer of received data to the ground and their processing.
       The space platform "Kosmos-2519" with the satellite-inspector was launched on June 23. During the tests, the satellite undocked, began an autonomous flight, changed the orbit, and then returned to it, having made an inspection, the newspaper writes.
       According to the Russian Main Center for the Exploration of the Space Environment, similar projects are being implemented by the United States and China.

Offline jcm

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #149 on: 10/26/2017 10:17 PM »
Here's the orbital period vs time (host, red; inspector, blue)
The question is whether 'returned to base' just meant returned to prox ops or actual redocking?
-----------------------------

Jonathan McDowell
http://planet4589.org

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #150 on: 10/27/2017 12:41 AM »
The lack of accuracy in the TLEs does not allow us to definitively decide whether the two satellites have docked or if they are just close together.

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #151 on: 10/27/2017 07:41 AM »
https://iz.ru/662230/sergei-valchenko-nikolai-surkov-aleksei-ramm/rossiia-poslala-na-orbitu-inspektora

Google translation:

The Russian Space Forces successfully tested a maneuvering military reconnaissance satellite capable of flying up to other orbital vehicles and inspecting them. Such devices will allow to determine the functionality of foreign spy satellites, and also, if necessary, to create space fighter-satellites on their basis.

According to domestic experts, maneuvering satellites-inspectors will become an important element of the Russian orbital grouping, they will play the role of a deterrent in the space military race.

As Izvestia was informed by the Defense Ministry, in the course of tests to control a maneuvering military satellite, ground and orbital communications were tested, ballistic calculation methods and new software were tested. Confirmed the capabilities of the Space Forces to automatically undock the satellite from the platform, remote control of its flight, the use of on-board equipment, including surveillance equipment, as well as the transfer of received data to the ground and their processing.
According to Izvestia, during the tests the maneuvering satellite undocked from the space platform Kosmos-2519, launched on June 23, 2017, and began an autonomous flight. First, he changed the orbit, and then managed to return to the platform and perform its inspection.
According to the Russian Main Space Exploration Center, projects for the creation of spacecraft capable of changing their orbit and approaching other space objects on command from the Earth are also being implemented by the United States and China. So, in July 2013, Western media reported that China experienced three small satellites. Experts suggested that the tests were conducted within the framework of the secret program for the development of an anti-satellite system. One of the three vehicles was even equipped with a manipulator.
Independent military expert Valery Mukhin told Izvestia that the satellites-inspectors are an important component of the orbital forces of any space power.
"In the case of a global conflict, it is extremely important to destroy the enemy's satellite grouping in order to deprive them of communication, navigation and the possibility of reconnaissance, so the idea of ​​creating such fighters appeared," the expert said. - In the USSR, for example, tests were conducted, during which one satellite flew to another and exploded, hitting the target with fragments. After these experiments, there were even attempts to create armored satellites.

According to Valery Mukhin, the main task of the orbital "inspectors" is to establish the purpose of the vehicles placed by the potential enemy in orbit.

- By the appearance of the object, its design, the location of the equipment can make assumptions about its purpose, - explained the expert. - In addition, the satellite-inspector can easily combine the inspection functions with the functions of a fighter: went over, inspected, released a rocket, departed.

However, Mukhin stressed that fighter companions would be needed for Russia only in case of conflict, and there is enough work for inspectors in peacetime.
"Such a device needs the ability to actively maneuver between orbits, this is what the military is currently practicing during the tests," the expert said. "Having such a system will become a serious deterrent for potential opponents." They will know that the Russian Federation can check whether the functionality of their devices corresponds to the claimed device.

The idea to create fighter satellites was born even in times of confrontation between the US and the USSR. For example, in the USSR there was an IP program - "Fighter satellites." Its task was to disable the US missile warning system during the threatened period of spacecraft. Then everything rested on the price of IP devices: they cost more than the object of impact. Now with the advent of technology to produce low-cost compact spacecraft, the situation can radically change.
« Last Edit: 10/27/2017 12:57 PM by Alter Sachse »

Offline Liss

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #152 on: 10/27/2017 04:36 PM »
So the only news is that the Russian MoD acknowledged some details already known from TLEs for weeks.
This message reflects my personal opinion based on open sources of information.

Offline B. Hendrickx

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #153 on: 10/30/2017 08:21 PM »
Confusing statement from the Ministry of Defense on the Kosmos-2519 mission today (as quoted by TASS) :

http://tass.ru/armiya-i-opk/4686774

(my quick translation)

"According to [the Ministry of Defense] a satellite-platform was launched from Plesetsk on 23 June 2017 in the interests of the Ministry of Defense to conduct a scientific experiment to study a Russian satellite with the help of a small satellite launched from this platform.

Today, in the next step of the experiment, a satellite inspector was detached from the small satellite. The inspector is capable of diagnosing the technical condition of a/the (?) Russian satellite from the closest possible distance using special equipment.  The obtained information will be sent to Earth for detailed analysis and to decide whether the observed satellite will be restored to working order".

Literally interpreted, this would suggest that the object separated from Kosmos-2519 on 23 August (later called Kosmos-2521) has now itself deployed an object, but I wonder if TASS somehow got the wording wrong. Perhaps Kosmos-2521 returned to the mother satellite and has now been separated for the second time.

It's also not clear what satellite is going to be inspected this time. Since Russian has no articles, the report could be referring to either the same object observed earlier by the "small satellite" or another one. The satellite inspected earlier presumably was the Kosmos-2519 mother satellite itself. Now the target appears to be a satellite that has malfunctioned (or are they talking about a simulated observation of a malfunctioning satellite?). Many unanswered questions... 

Just wondering : is Cosmos-2486/Persona-2 still anywhere in the neighborhood?

Offline Phillip Clark

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #154 on: 10/31/2017 05:49 AM »
A new piece of debris, 2017-037E, has been cataloogued from the launch in the last 24 hours.

The orbital data for the objects still in orbit for this launch are (catnum, epoch, inclination deg, orbital period min, perigee and apogee km and argument of perigee deg):-

42798     2017 Oct 30.895    97.91       97.91      650       667    185
42800     2017 Oct 30.786    98.04       93.57      284       615    339
42919     2017 Oct 30.759    97.91       97.91      651       667    185
42986     2017 Oct 31.089    97.88       96.88      554       664    215


Cosmos 2486 was never really close to Cosmos 2519/2521: their orbital planes were close but neither satellite never got physically close to the Kvarts satellite.
« Last Edit: 10/31/2017 07:30 AM by Phillip Clark »

Offline Nicolas PILLET

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #155 on: 10/31/2017 10:20 AM »
According to my informations, Cosmos 2519 is 14Ф150 №8120.

https://www.kosmonavtika.com/lancements/2017/23062017/23062017.html
Nicolas PILLET
Kosmonavtika : The French site on Russian Space

Offline Alter Sachse

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Re: Kosmos 2519 - Soyuz-2.1v/Volga - Plesetsk - June 23, 2017
« Reply #156 on: 10/31/2017 12:38 PM »
According to my informations, Cosmos 2519 is 14Ф150 №8120.

https://www.kosmonavtika.com/lancements/2017/23062017/23062017.html
No. 8120 does not seem to be 14F150 no. 2.
Rather no. 1.

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