Author Topic: Eutelsat OneWeb: Mega-constellation/Company - General Thread  (Read 658155 times)

Offline eeergo

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Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Interview with OneWeb CEO:

https://www.spaceintelreport.com/interview-eric-beranger-chief-executive-oneweb

Is it me, or is he a little cagey about financing ... ?!

Offline WmThomas

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Interview with OneWeb CEO:

https://www.spaceintelreport.com/interview-eric-beranger-chief-executive-oneweb

Is it me, or is he a little cagey about financing ... ?!
The whole thing sounds weird. Ground stations??? What's the point, then?

Quote
How does a boat in the Pacific get OneWeb?

Very easily. We have simple terminals that are very easy to use.

But how does the signal get landed? You don’t have intersatellite links.

We have a network of gateway Earth stations that are cleverly distributed, in such a way that to this user it will be exactly like using a normal landline.

Offline edkyle99

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Interview with OneWeb CEO:

https://www.spaceintelreport.com/interview-eric-beranger-chief-executive-oneweb

Is it me, or is he a little cagey about financing ... ?!
CEO-speak. 

Wasn't Virgin a big investor?

Giving Little-LEO one more go, all the others having ended in bankruptcy.  To me, these constellations look like a swarm of space junk.  But I'm from the 1960s, so what do I know?

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Offline gosnold

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Interview with OneWeb CEO:

https://www.spaceintelreport.com/interview-eric-beranger-chief-executive-oneweb

Is it me, or is he a little cagey about financing ... ?!

Yup, saying "To be clear, there were figures published before my time about the target cost per satellite. I wouldn’t use those figures now." sounds really weird. Seems like they cannot meet their 500k$ per satellite cost.





Quote
How does a boat in the Pacific get OneWeb?

Very easily. We have simple terminals that are very easy to use.

But how does the signal get landed? You don’t have intersatellite links.

We have a network of gateway Earth stations that are cleverly distributed, in such a way that to this user it will be exactly like using a normal landline.

I think the maritime market is not that big, so they don't want to add inter satellite links to their design because of it. They probably think they can manage with ground stations on the shores, plus ground station on islands with GEO/O3b backhaul to cover the rest. Since their satellites orbit relatively high, their horizon is far away so coastal ground stations should cover al lot of area.

Online meekGee

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Interview with OneWeb CEO:

https://www.spaceintelreport.com/interview-eric-beranger-chief-executive-oneweb

Is it me, or is he a little cagey about financing ... ?!
The whole thing sounds weird. Ground stations??? What's the point, then?

Quote
How does a boat in the Pacific get OneWeb?

Very easily. We have simple terminals that are very easy to use.

But how does the signal get landed? You don’t have intersatellite links.

We have a network of gateway Earth stations that are cleverly distributed, in such a way that to this user it will be exactly like using a normal landline.

Ever since the first constellation concepts, there were two schools of thought - have the satellites simply be last-mile collection mechanisms that use ground stations to hook up to terrestrial long haul nets, or have the satellites also create the backbone itself.

SpaceX is going for the second, much more complex, but also more lucrative, option.  OneWeb is going for the simpler idea, but it means they are "captive" by the existing long haul infrastructure providers
ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

Offline jongoff

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Interview with OneWeb CEO:

https://www.spaceintelreport.com/interview-eric-beranger-chief-executive-oneweb

Is it me, or is he a little cagey about financing ... ?!
The whole thing sounds weird. Ground stations??? What's the point, then?

Quote
How does a boat in the Pacific get OneWeb?

Very easily. We have simple terminals that are very easy to use.

But how does the signal get landed? You don’t have intersatellite links.

We have a network of gateway Earth stations that are cleverly distributed, in such a way that to this user it will be exactly like using a normal landline.

Ever since the first constellation concepts, there were two schools of thought - have the satellites simply be last-mile collection mechanisms that use ground stations to hook up to terrestrial long haul nets, or have the satellites also create the backbone itself.

SpaceX is going for the second, much more complex, but also more lucrative, option.  OneWeb is going for the simpler idea, but it means they are "captive" by the existing long haul infrastructure providers

True, but if OneWeb is successful with their first constellation, they'll have the money to add intersatellite links in a follow-on generation if its determined to be useful. There's something to be said for keeping the amount of capital for their first system in an achievable range, and getting to market quicker. But long-term I hope they add intersatellite links, and if possible the ability to provide intersatellite links to 3rd party spacecraft/space facilities to their 2nd generation constellation. But getting the first one flying is a big enough first step.

~Jon

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Just to give some context, Iridium's revenue is over 4 times that of Globalstar, and that's before Iridium's more ambitious second generation constellation has been activated.

Can you guess which one (Iridium or Globalstar) has satellite interconnects and which one doesn't?

SpaceX's ambition with their constellation is a factor of 10 and perhaps 100 times that of OneWeb's.

Not just number of satellites, but throughput per satellite, low altitude, satellite interconnect. Per-user bandwidth. Latency. User terminals. Everything.

The SpaceX constellation is JUST as ambitious as ITS is.
Chris  Whoever loves correction loves knowledge, but he who hates reproof is stupid.

To the maximum extent practicable, the Federal Government shall plan missions to accommodate the space transportation services capabilities of United States commercial providers. US law http://goo.gl/YZYNt0

Online meekGee

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Interview with OneWeb CEO:

https://www.spaceintelreport.com/interview-eric-beranger-chief-executive-oneweb

Is it me, or is he a little cagey about financing ... ?!
The whole thing sounds weird. Ground stations??? What's the point, then?

Quote
How does a boat in the Pacific get OneWeb?

Very easily. We have simple terminals that are very easy to use.

But how does the signal get landed? You don’t have intersatellite links.

We have a network of gateway Earth stations that are cleverly distributed, in such a way that to this user it will be exactly like using a normal landline.

Ever since the first constellation concepts, there were two schools of thought - have the satellites simply be last-mile collection mechanisms that use ground stations to hook up to terrestrial long haul nets, or have the satellites also create the backbone itself.

SpaceX is going for the second, much more complex, but also more lucrative, option.  OneWeb is going for the simpler idea, but it means they are "captive" by the existing long haul infrastructure providers

True, but if OneWeb is successful with their first constellation, they'll have the money to add intersatellite links in a follow-on generation if its determined to be useful. There's something to be said for keeping the amount of capital for their first system in an achievable range, and getting to market quicker. But long-term I hope they add intersatellite links, and if possible the ability to provide intersatellite links to 3rd party spacecraft/space facilities to their 2nd generation constellation. But getting the first one flying is a big enough first step.

~Jon
Agreed - they are what they are, both of them.

I was responding to the "what's the point" question.

BFC is simply more ambitious.  The reason why, IMO, is that Musk currently has the lead in launch capability, and in a telecom venture like this, first-to-market really matters, so he's striking while the metal's hot.

« Last Edit: 03/23/2017 05:24 am by meekGee »
ABCD - Always Be Counting Down

Offline Ronsmytheiii

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Looks like the ground has been cleared at Exploration park for Oneweb's Florida manufacturing facility:

taken from Planet Explorer Beta program, dated April 20, 2017:

https://www.planet.com/explorer/#/center/-80.677,28.514/zoom/17
« Last Edit: 04/22/2017 03:44 pm by Ronsmytheiii »

Offline gongora

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[Space Intel Report] OneWeb promises US regulators 2019 Alaska coverage; Intelsat merger unclear
Quote
Start-up satellite constellation operator OneWeb on May 19 told U.S. regulators that it would be able to provide broadband access to all of Alaska in 2019.
...
OneWeb, which for regulatory purposes is also known as WorldVu Satellites, said its final assembly line for the first 10 of its 880 satellites would be in operation at the Airbus Defence and Space plant in Toulouse, France, in June.
...
Full production-rate launches, aboard Europeanized Russian Soyuz rockets, is expected to start by the end of 2018
...
OneWeb has raised $1.7 billion, with the latest investment of $1.2 billion coming from SoftBank of Japan. SoftBank is organizing the acquisition of venerable satellite fleet operator Intelsat by offering some Intelsat bondholders to exchange their debt for cash and debt.

The transaction has struggled to win bondholder support. SoftBank recently sweetened the offer and extended its deadline for acceptance to May 31.

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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At #OneWeb request, @Arianespace looking to increase Soyuz sat-dispenser capacity to 36 150-kg OneWeb sats, from 32: Arianespace's Breton.

https://twitter.com/pbdes/status/866831317937160192

Offline Nomadd

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Just to give some context, Iridium's revenue is over 4 times that of Globalstar, and that's before Iridium's more ambitious second generation constellation has been activated.

Can you guess which one (Iridium or Globalstar) has satellite interconnects and which one doesn't?

SpaceX's ambition with their constellation is a factor of 10 and perhaps 100 times that of OneWeb's.

Not just number of satellites, but throughput per satellite, low altitude, satellite interconnect. Per-user bandwidth. Latency. User terminals. Everything.

The SpaceX constellation is JUST as ambitious as ITS is.
Globalstar isn't helped by everybody's memories of the system becoming almost unusable with little or no warning, even though the operators knew what was going on. I dumpstered dozens of those systems when the sats started failing. The main reason anybody ever used them was Iridiums crappy voice quality. I couldn't believe the new system was sticking with 2400bps voice channels.
Those who danced were thought to be quite insane by those who couldn't hear the music.

Offline gongora

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OneWeb's proposed merger with Intelsat fell through.  They can still cooperate even if they're not combining into a single company.

Intelsat Announces Termination of Debt Exchange Offers and Anticipated Termination of Conditional Combination Agreement with OneWeb and Share Purchase Agreement with SoftBank
Quote
LUXEMBOURG--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Jun. 1, 2017-- Intelsat S.A. (NYSE:I) (“Intelsat”) today announced that the previously announced (i) offer or offers to exchange (collectively, the “Exchange Offers”) certain of the respective outstanding senior unsecured notes (the “Existing Notes”) issued by its indirect wholly-owned subsidiaries, Intelsat Jackson Holdings S.A., Intelsat Connect Finance S.A., and Intelsat (Luxembourg) S.A. (collectively, the “Issuers”) and (ii) solicitation or solicitations of consents (collectively, the “Consent Solicitations”) to amend the indentures governing the Existing Notes expired pursuant to their terms at 12:00 midnight, New York City time, on May 31, 2017. As of the expiration date, the minimum tender conditions for the Exchange Offers and Consent Solicitations had not been satisfied. The Issuers have not accepted any of the Existing Notes for exchange, any Existing Notes tendered for exchange will be promptly returned to holders, and the Exchange Offers and Consent Solicitations have accordingly been terminated.

The Exchange Offers and Consent Solicitations were conducted pursuant to the Combination Agreement, dated as of February 28, 2017 (as amended by that certain First Amendment to and Waiver Relating to the Combination Agreement, dated May 17, 2017, the “Combination Agreement”), between Intelsat and WorldVu Satellites Limited (“OneWeb”), pursuant to which Intelsat and OneWeb would combine through a merger, and the related Share Purchase Agreement, dated as of February 28, 2017 (as amended by that certain First Amendment to and Agreement Relating to the Share Purchase Agreement, dated as of May 17, 2017, the “Share Purchase Agreement”) among Intelsat, SoftBank Group Corp. (“SoftBank”) and OneWeb, pursuant to which SoftBank would make a cash investment in exchange for common and preferred shares of the combined company contemporaneous with the closing under the Combination Agreement. The successful completion of the Exchange Offers would have satisfied a condition to completion of the transactions under the Combination Agreement and the Share Purchase Agreement. Intelsat has notified OneWeb and SoftBank of the failure to consummate the Exchange Offers.

As a result of the termination of the Exchange Offers, Intelsat currently expects that OneWeb and SoftBank will exercise their respective termination rights under the Combination Agreement and related Share Purchase Agreement on June 2.

Intelsat CEO Stephen Spengler said, “There were many stakeholders’ interests that needed to be satisfied in this complex transaction. We are disappointed that our bondholders were unwilling to accept the terms of the exchange offers presented over the course of this process. Even without a merger of our companies, the pre-existing commercial agreement among Intelsat, OneWeb and SoftBank will continue. Under this agreement, we plan to jointly develop integrated solutions utilizing both of our fleets and to act as a sub-distributor to SoftBank for the attractive application segments of mobility, energy, government, and connected car. As we create integrated services for these applications, we expect to accelerate and enhance our goal of unlocking new and larger opportunities in the communications landscape. We remain focused on achieving our operating priorities for 2017, including the continued commercialization of our Intelsat EpicNG® high throughput satellite services.”

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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OneWeb1/ @greg_wyler confirms Intelsat deal dead; to inaugurate Toulouse sat prod line (1st 10 sats) June 27; these sats launch spring 2018.

https://twitter.com/pbdes/status/870899590572240896

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It seems kind of optimistic for them to expect to launch 10 satellites in the Spring if they haven't even inaugurated the assembly line. But who knows? Maybe they can do it.
Chris  Whoever loves correction loves knowledge, but he who hates reproof is stupid.

To the maximum extent practicable, the Federal Government shall plan missions to accommodate the space transportation services capabilities of United States commercial providers. US law http://goo.gl/YZYNt0

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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It seems kind of optimistic for them to expect to launch 10 satellites in the Spring if they haven't even inaugurated the assembly line. But who knows? Maybe they can do it.

OneWeb said in March they had started satellite production. So either that didn't mean construction or maybe it was lab rather than 'production line' based?

Offline AncientU

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OneWeb1/ @greg_wyler confirms Intelsat deal dead; to inaugurate Toulouse sat prod line (1st 10 sats) June 27; these sats launch spring 2018.

https://twitter.com/pbdes/status/870899590572240896

What was the bottom line that killed this deal?  Something made the bindholders balk...

Quote
Intelsat CEO Stephen Spengler said, “There were many stakeholders’ interests that needed to be satisfied in this complex transaction. We are disappointed that our bondholders were unwilling to accept the terms of the exchange offers presented over the course of this process.
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Offline oldAtlas_Eguy

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It seems kind of optimistic for them to expect to launch 10 satellites in the Spring if they haven't even inaugurated the assembly line. But who knows? Maybe they can do it.
Two things this initial production line is not in the US but in an existing sat mfg facility in EU. But it does do one thing very different than normal sat production. The production line is a trial assembly line using normal industry practices for moderate count mass produced products. Less of the normal sat assembly of add part and test and more of the add all the parts then test. If the sat fails acceptance test, fix or break apart for parts throwing away suspected failure items. plus analyzing if assembly procedure for the involved part or parts was the reason for failure. If the later correct assembly procedure. Most of this is what you see in the high end electronics industry where end counts of a specific model is in the thousand range. At higher mfg rates the acceptance testing is actually a sampling and not 100%. But for this assembly line it will most likely be 100% but not the slower previous procedures of careful add part and test/inspect thoroughly before adding next part.

One method takes years the other months. For small sats which OneWeb is, the shortened and faster method is better suited for mfg of not just 5 or even 20 sats but over a 1,000 in the end.

Offline gongora

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Draft of FCC order in favor of granting OneWeb access to the U.S. market.  Apparently this will be discussed at an FCC meeting later this month.

I only found this because it was referenced in another document (comments by ViaSat submitted for the OneWeb application).  Does anyone know where these drafts can be accessed on the FCC site if you don't already know they're there?
« Last Edit: 06/14/2017 04:46 pm by gongora »

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