Author Topic: RS-25 testing/development at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION  (Read 34285 times)

Offline newpylong

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #20 on: 12/25/2014 12:42 AM »
Simulations are simulations, not reality. 129 tons or 130 tons, J-2X is not going to happen. If the mandate is not met, so be it. No one will count in 10 years.

Offline Patchouli

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #21 on: 12/25/2014 02:03 AM »
IIRC the new RS-25 controller and the new J2X controller are one in the same.  So Block II SLS will use a common controller on bothe the core and the upper stage.
Unlikely. SLS, as currently envisioned up to the 130 mT version, will never fly J-2X on any upper stage.

My simulations show you need a J-2X or four MB-60 second stage engines to get to 130 t, regardless of the boosters used.

The MB-60 stage actually gets a little better TMI performance while the J-2X has better LEO performance.

Though on IMLEO numbers SLS Block 1A supposedly can get 120tons of payload with the liquid  Pyrios boosters.
« Last Edit: 12/25/2014 02:09 AM by Patchouli »

Offline Hog

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #22 on: 01/05/2015 02:49 PM »
Apparently the new RS25 uses about 60% of the tested J2X controller according to Mr Phillip Sloss's article
http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2015/01/nasa-ready-power-up-rs-25-engine/

From Mr Chris Bergin's post introducing the article.
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=36465.0

ME-0525 on the stand at Stennis could be making H2O (hot firing) in very short order.

I would love to have a video feed onf the test stand.(dreams)
Paul

Offline Hog

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #23 on: 01/08/2015 09:41 PM »
Still holding for a test, we're on the cusp of the mighty RS-25D roaring to life.
Paul

Offline Hog

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #24 on: 01/09/2015 09:31 AM »
While we wait:

According to the attached reference from the Block III SSME proposal, there are a total of three Block-III Develoment Engines with Development Units #1(10,000 seconds of run time) and #3(16,000 seconds of run time)  totalling  80 combined starts on the A-1 Test Stand.
Development Unit #2 having 30 starts(12,000 seconds run time) on the A-2 Test Stand.
Combined starts for all 3 Development Block III SSME's is 110, with a combined runtime across both the A-1 and A-2 test stands at 38,000 seconds.

There is also mention of the two Block III SSME Certification Engines referred to as Cert Engine #004 and #005.
Certification Engine #004 had 22 A-2 test stand starts with 11,000 seconds of run time, and Cert. Engine #005 had 22 A-1 Test STand starts and 11,000 seconds of run time.

So with all 5 of these Block III SSME's we have 154 starts, and a total of 60,000 seconds(1000 minutes or 16-1/3 hours) of run time.

So Block III SSME appears, in my common view, to be a viable option for future RS25 maturation(both Block III and Block III-Phase 2(with Advanced Health Management System).

Attachment 1: Test Matrix
Attachment 2: The complete Block III RS25 proposal(please rotate once downloaded)
« Last Edit: 01/09/2015 09:38 AM by Hog »
Paul

Offline AnalogMan

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #25 on: 01/09/2015 10:37 AM »
Here's a copy of the Block III SSME Upgrade Project Overview presentation with the pages rotated to the correct orientation.

Offline Hog

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #26 on: 01/09/2015 04:57 PM »
Here's a copy of the Block III SSME Upgrade Project Overview presentation with the pages rotated to the correct orientation.
Thank you very much AnalogMan.

I bid the Stennis team all the best for todays hotfire test.
Go RS-25, burn, baby, burn!
Paul

Offline catdlr

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Tony De La Rosa

Offline Ronpur50

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #28 on: 01/10/2015 05:12 PM »
Exciting video!!
Question: I see two vehicles close by the test facility, is there someone inside that thing during the test??

Offline Hog

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #29 on: 01/11/2015 06:16 PM »
Test Video

http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=36465.msg1312812#msg1312812
There is a lot going on in that video, and some which has been editted.  A few seconds before shutdown, you can see an instability develop and the video cuts to a wide view of the test stand.

I thank NASA and Aerojet/Rocketdyne for allowing these videos to be released.  Hugely interesting.  I'm sure all the people who work/have worked with these thoroughbreds are proud of their accomplishments. Amazing hardware!
Paul

Offline MarkM

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #30 on: 01/22/2015 07:10 PM »

In the article posted on Jan 2 it is mentioned that the head pressures for the fuel and oxidisers will be greater for SLS as opposed to the shuttle.  I am just wondering how that would affect the performance of the engines?  Increase/decrease thrust or ISP?  And will it be a greater or less stress on the turbine pumps?

I guess the reason for the tests are two determine the outcomes but if anyone wanted to make an informed guess I would very much appreciate it!

Thanks
Mark

Offline Steven Pietrobon

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #31 on: 01/23/2015 06:18 AM »
I don't think there will be any significant change in performance. A higher head pressure implies that the boost pumps would need slightly less work to perform in order to get the output pressure to be the same, so there might be a very small, perhaps negligible, increase in performance. In any case, the engines are going to be operated at a higher thrust level compared to shuttle, at 109% (111% for new RS-25s) compared to 104% for the Space Shuttle.
« Last Edit: 01/23/2015 06:25 AM by Steven Pietrobon »
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline MarkM

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #32 on: 01/23/2015 12:57 PM »
Thanks Steven!

Offline Hog

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #33 on: 01/27/2015 04:27 PM »

In the article posted on Jan 2 it is mentioned that the head pressures for the fuel and oxidisers will be greater for SLS as opposed to the shuttle.  I am just wondering how that would affect the performance of the engines?  Increase/decrease thrust or ISP?  And will it be a greater or less stress on the turbine pumps?

I guess the reason for the tests are two determine the outcomes but if anyone wanted to make an informed guess I would very much appreciate it!

Thanks
Mark
SLS also be experiencing greater G loading(3.3g) during ascent than STS(3 g) did, which in effect increases head pressure even more.
Paul

Offline newpylong

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Offline Hog

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #35 on: 05/29/2015 03:10 AM »
http://www.nasa.gov/exploration/systems/sls/some-assembly-required-the-newest-rs-25-joins-the-space-launch-system-family.html

16th RS-25 completed.

I believe there also was an engine test today.
Yes, 2063 is the 16th engine completed, and according to NASA there are 2 RS-25D engines that have no flight experience. Once acceptance testing of 2063 is complete, it will join the other 14 veterans and the other rookie engine(which is E2062).

Waiting for the test video, should be cool as always.




« Last Edit: 05/29/2015 03:14 AM by Hog »
Paul

Offline Hog

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #36 on: 05/29/2015 03:12 AM »
Block II/RS25D Engines with flight experience (listed with last mission flown)
1)  2044  STS-133
2)  2045  STS-135
3)  2047  STS-135
4)  2048  STS-133
5)  2050  STS-120
6)  2051  STS-132
7)  2052  STS-132
8)  2054  STS-131
9)  2056  STS-121
10) 2057 STS-134
11) 2058 STS-133
12) 2059 STS-134
13) 2060 STS-135
14) 2061 STS-134

Unflown Block II/RS25D engines
15) 2062 (circa 2010 build)
16) 2063 (2015 build)

E2049, 2053 & 2055 were lost on STS-107
E2043 was a flown Block IIA engine/RS25C but was never flown in a full Block II configuration
E2046 is not listed as a flown or unflown engine or if even existed
« Last Edit: 05/29/2015 03:13 AM by Hog »
Paul

Offline OnWithTheShow

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #37 on: 05/29/2015 03:32 AM »
Quote
The RS-25 is unique among many engines in that it automatically runs through its cycles and programs.
from http://www.nasa.gov/image-feature/steamy-summer-begins-for-sls-with-rs-25-test

What?!?!?

Offline Welsh Dragon

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #38 on: 05/29/2015 08:20 AM »
What's the engine standing nozzle up in the background from 0:20 or so in the video above? The one with the dark nozzle extension? RL-10?

Offline German Space Fan

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Re: RS-25 testing at Stennis for SLS - DISCUSSION
« Reply #39 on: 05/29/2015 01:08 PM »
Im not entirely sure, but I think its a J2-X. :o

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