Quote from: the_other_Doug on 09/27/2015 01:20 amQuote from: Dalhousie on 09/27/2015 12:21 amQuote from: hop on 09/26/2015 06:55 pmQuote from: NovaSilisko on 09/26/2015 04:36 amPerhaps related, a tweet from Emily a while ago said the team has never been planning on really climbing much of the mountain: Right, from the beginning, there's never been hasn't been much serious talk about going much higher than the clay/sulfate transition, and a lot of the really interesting stuff is lower than that. This is shown in the attached from the extended mission proposal.edit:Correction: IIRC there was some talk of maybe eventually getting to the top of the sulfate layers, but that would be after multiple extended missions.The top of the clay-sulphate transition is about 900m higher than where the rover is now. So still a substantial climb.Currently, more than halfway into the extended mission, Curiosity is about about the point next to the first set of numbers. So they are well behind that prediction. There has been a long history of excessive optimism over what would be achieved emanating from the Curiosity team. Expectations prior to launch were that it would have covered the round it has in only a few months. These were cut back before landing, but still well in excess of what was achieved. All this was pointed out in a highly critical external review, which JPL seem to have shrugged off.I think you have to take into account that the Curiosity team has had to make choices as they go along their traverse and see new and fascinating/important things that demand they stop and investigate.There has never been a "we go to the specified stops and stay there for the specified times and arrive at the specified locations on the specified dates" kind of agenda for Curiosity. It has always been a plan-as-you-go kind of approach, where the team weighs the important new discoveries to be made on whatever new terrain they find themselves, versus the potential discoveries to be made at places farther along the route.A tremendous amount of information has come from the investigations thus far. The primary mission of MSL, to characterize an environment that could have supported life back 3 billion years ago, was achieved in the first few months during its investigations at Yellowknife Bay. Everything that has come since has been gravy.Thus, while there are many interesting terrains yet to come, there was never a mission objective that said "We will climb Mt. Sharp and look around Gale from its peak and we will have failed if we don't achieve this." There was never much interest in Sharp's upper slopes, which are bland and homogeneous-looking, and it's quite likely that Curiosity will get to the various terrain layers that were originally planned to be explored on the lower slopes.It simply doesn't make sense to rush along, ignoring the wealth of data you're driving past, just to make an arbitrary location by an arbitrary date. I think the MSL team is doing it right.No objections with how it's done. However I do object with the constant over promising compared to what is being delivered. Its unnecessary and counterproductive.
Quote from: Dalhousie on 09/27/2015 12:21 amQuote from: hop on 09/26/2015 06:55 pmQuote from: NovaSilisko on 09/26/2015 04:36 amPerhaps related, a tweet from Emily a while ago said the team has never been planning on really climbing much of the mountain: Right, from the beginning, there's never been hasn't been much serious talk about going much higher than the clay/sulfate transition, and a lot of the really interesting stuff is lower than that. This is shown in the attached from the extended mission proposal.edit:Correction: IIRC there was some talk of maybe eventually getting to the top of the sulfate layers, but that would be after multiple extended missions.The top of the clay-sulphate transition is about 900m higher than where the rover is now. So still a substantial climb.Currently, more than halfway into the extended mission, Curiosity is about about the point next to the first set of numbers. So they are well behind that prediction. There has been a long history of excessive optimism over what would be achieved emanating from the Curiosity team. Expectations prior to launch were that it would have covered the round it has in only a few months. These were cut back before landing, but still well in excess of what was achieved. All this was pointed out in a highly critical external review, which JPL seem to have shrugged off.I think you have to take into account that the Curiosity team has had to make choices as they go along their traverse and see new and fascinating/important things that demand they stop and investigate.There has never been a "we go to the specified stops and stay there for the specified times and arrive at the specified locations on the specified dates" kind of agenda for Curiosity. It has always been a plan-as-you-go kind of approach, where the team weighs the important new discoveries to be made on whatever new terrain they find themselves, versus the potential discoveries to be made at places farther along the route.A tremendous amount of information has come from the investigations thus far. The primary mission of MSL, to characterize an environment that could have supported life back 3 billion years ago, was achieved in the first few months during its investigations at Yellowknife Bay. Everything that has come since has been gravy.Thus, while there are many interesting terrains yet to come, there was never a mission objective that said "We will climb Mt. Sharp and look around Gale from its peak and we will have failed if we don't achieve this." There was never much interest in Sharp's upper slopes, which are bland and homogeneous-looking, and it's quite likely that Curiosity will get to the various terrain layers that were originally planned to be explored on the lower slopes.It simply doesn't make sense to rush along, ignoring the wealth of data you're driving past, just to make an arbitrary location by an arbitrary date. I think the MSL team is doing it right.
Quote from: hop on 09/26/2015 06:55 pmQuote from: NovaSilisko on 09/26/2015 04:36 amPerhaps related, a tweet from Emily a while ago said the team has never been planning on really climbing much of the mountain: Right, from the beginning, there's never been hasn't been much serious talk about going much higher than the clay/sulfate transition, and a lot of the really interesting stuff is lower than that. This is shown in the attached from the extended mission proposal.edit:Correction: IIRC there was some talk of maybe eventually getting to the top of the sulfate layers, but that would be after multiple extended missions.The top of the clay-sulphate transition is about 900m higher than where the rover is now. So still a substantial climb.Currently, more than halfway into the extended mission, Curiosity is about about the point next to the first set of numbers. So they are well behind that prediction. There has been a long history of excessive optimism over what would be achieved emanating from the Curiosity team. Expectations prior to launch were that it would have covered the round it has in only a few months. These were cut back before landing, but still well in excess of what was achieved. All this was pointed out in a highly critical external review, which JPL seem to have shrugged off.
Quote from: NovaSilisko on 09/26/2015 04:36 amPerhaps related, a tweet from Emily a while ago said the team has never been planning on really climbing much of the mountain: Right, from the beginning, there's never been hasn't been much serious talk about going much higher than the clay/sulfate transition, and a lot of the really interesting stuff is lower than that. This is shown in the attached from the extended mission proposal.edit:Correction: IIRC there was some talk of maybe eventually getting to the top of the sulfate layers, but that would be after multiple extended missions.
Perhaps related, a tweet from Emily a while ago said the team has never been planning on really climbing much of the mountain:
Recent science paper Deposition, exhumation, and paleoclimate of an ancient lake deposit, Gale crater, Mars (paywall) (NASA news release)BBC report has a really nice interview covering the background:http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-34490337
What has caught the attention of Dr. Vasavada and his colleagues lately is silica, a class of minerals made of silicon and oxygen. The evidence points to the action of liquid water even after the lakes disappeared.“Groundwater passed through the rock multiple times, leaving different chemical signatures behind,” Dr. Vasavada said.
So we all placed friendly bets on what sort of silica phase we would find,” said Elizabeth Rampe, another member of the science team for Curiosity. “But we could never have predicted this result.”It was tridymite, a mineral that is rare on Earth and has never seen before on Mars. “And we actually found a lot of it,” Dr. Rampe said.On Earth, tridymite generally forms at high temperatures in volcanic or metamorphic rocks, not a finely layered sedimentary rock like Buckskin. That may tell something about the origin of the sediments, or it is possible that tridymite forms through a different process on Mars.In the younger sandstone, the scientists found a different type of silica known as Opal-A along fractures in the rocks.The scientists hypothesize two possibilities: acidic water washed away the other elements, or neutral water washed in silica that accumulated in the sandstone. “They both involve liquid water,” said Albert Yen of NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory, another science team member. “We’re just trying to figure out the flavor of the water.”The scientists did not present new findings on organics, the carbon-based molecules that could serve as the building blocks for life. Dr. Vasavada said that signs of organics had been spotted, but the scientists were still analyzing them.“Stay tuned,” he said. “There are organics in several of these samples we’ve been seeing lately.”
Mars Rover Finds Changing Rocks, Surprising ScientistsQuoteWhat has caught the attention of Dr. Vasavada and his colleagues lately is silica, a class of minerals made of silicon and oxygen. The evidence points to the action of liquid water even after the lakes disappeared.“Groundwater passed through the rock multiple times, leaving different chemical signatures behind,” Dr. Vasavada said.QuoteSo we all placed friendly bets on what sort of silica phase we would find,” said Elizabeth Rampe, another member of the science team for Curiosity. “But we could never have predicted this result.”It was tridymite, a mineral that is rare on Earth and has never seen before on Mars. “And we actually found a lot of it,” Dr. Rampe said.On Earth, tridymite generally forms at high temperatures in volcanic or metamorphic rocks, not a finely layered sedimentary rock like Buckskin. That may tell something about the origin of the sediments, or it is possible that tridymite forms through a different process on Mars.In the younger sandstone, the scientists found a different type of silica known as Opal-A along fractures in the rocks.The scientists hypothesize two possibilities: acidic water washed away the other elements, or neutral water washed in silica that accumulated in the sandstone. “They both involve liquid water,” said Albert Yen of NASA’s Jet Propulsion Laboratory, another science team member. “We’re just trying to figure out the flavor of the water.”The scientists did not present new findings on organics, the carbon-based molecules that could serve as the building blocks for life. Dr. Vasavada said that signs of organics had been spotted, but the scientists were still analyzing them.“Stay tuned,” he said. “There are organics in several of these samples we’ve been seeing lately.”http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/12/18/science/mars-rover-finds-changing-rocks-surprising-scientists.html
Just in time for the holidays, NASA’s Curiosity rover is celebrating Christmas 2015 at a Red Planet Paradise – spectacular “Namib Dune.” And she marked the occasion by snapping her first ever color self-portrait with the mast mounted high resolution Mastcam 34 mm camera.Heretofore Curiosity has taken color self portraits with the MAHLI camera mounted at the end of the 7-foot-long (2-meter-long) robotic arm, and black and white self portraits with the mast mounted navcam camera.The new Mastcam color self portrait was taken just days ago on December 19, and includes the first ever color images of the rover deck. Previously, Curiosity has used the Mastcam color camera to take tens of thousands of exquisite high resolution panoramic images of the magnificent looking Martian terrain, but not the entire rover deck which includes the inlet ports for the pair of chemistry labs in the robots belly.Curiosity arrived at the outskirts of Namib Dune in mid-December. And as the images show Namib Dune is humongous and unlike anything encountered before by Curiosity. See our exclusive photo mosaics above and below from the image processing team of Ken Kremer and Marco Di Lorenzo.Why snap a Mastcam self portrait now? Because there’s unique science to be gained from the Red Planets swirling winds whipping up dust and sand particles with the rover now at the edge of the giant dune field at the foothills of Mount Sharp, and to check for buildup of particles on the rover deck.“The plan includes a Mastcam image of the rover deck to monitor the movement of particles,” wrote MSL science team member Lauren Edgar, Research Geologist at the USGS Astrogeology Science Center, in a mission update.Namib Dune is part of a massive field of spectacular rippled dark sand dunes, known as the “Bagnold Dunes” – located at the base of Mount Sharp and range up to two stories tall.The six wheeled rover was dispatched to the dunes to conduct humanity’s first up-close investigation of currently active sand dunes anywhere beyond Earth.“Namib is an Aeolian paradise,” wrote Edgar.“The view at Namib Dune is pretty spectacular. We’ve received a lot of beautiful Mastcam and Navcam images.”
In July 2015, on Sol 1060 (the number of Martian days since landing), the rover collected powder drilled from rock at a location named "Buckskin." Analyzing data from an X-ray diffraction instrument on the rover that identifies minerals, scientists detected significant amounts of a silica mineral called tridymite.This detection was a surprise to the scientists, because tridymite is generally associated with silicic volcanism, which is known on Earth but was not thought to be important or even present on Mars.
NASA Weighs Use of Rover to Image Potential Mars Water Sites...The features of interest have been observed by NASA’s High-Resolution Imaging Science Experiment (HiRISE) camera on the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter (MRO). They appear as dark lines that appear to ebb and flow over time. Planetary scientists think these gullies or recurring slope lineae (RSLs) may appear seasonally as a form of briny water at or near the surface of the Red Planet under warmer conditions.There are two RSL candidates that may be within Curiosity’s reach, on the side of the 3.1-mile-high (5-kilometer-high) Mount Sharp. The rover’s Remote Micro-Imager (part of ChemCam) would be the main instrument for imaging the possible sites. The goal would be to study the regions over time to see if there are any changes and to rule out other causes for the changes, such as dry avalanches....