Author Topic: Starlink : General Discussion - Thread 1  (Read 1217303 times)

Online gongora

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #980 on: 07/23/2016 12:34 am »
I wonder if the 1.66m^2 is the solar array?

That would give ~330w of power.

The other item is that the statement about 2 arrays (radio), is that 1 array for ground link and the other for sat to sat? Or 2 arrays, an up and downlink simplifying the receiver / transmitter arrangement?

It's talking about 2 solar arrays. Attachement 7 is an analysis of debris risk and how long the satellites will stay in orbit.  Solar array area looks to be 6x0.4=2.4m^2.  Huge difference in time to deorbit if the solar arrays fail to deploy (39 years instead of eight).  Also said these test satellites won't have propulsion or pressure vessels.  Attachment 7 can be found on this page: https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/els/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?id_file_num=0356-EX-PL-2015&application_seq=66082.  (Some of the "Informal Objection" documents are a hoot.)

Offline CyndyC

Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #981 on: 07/23/2016 03:00 am »
Does the Ettus referred to in the filing refer to https://www.ettus.com/  ?

Looks like it does, and lends some weight to Robotbeat's idea earlier, or you could say his idea supports that it does, although the question might remain whose radio will be the final answer.

They will use some fairly off the shelf radios, but the final birds will be far more advanced and will almost certainly contain a huge amount of custom equipment.

« Last Edit: 07/23/2016 03:50 am by CyndyC »
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Offline Ronsmytheiii

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #982 on: 07/23/2016 09:33 am »
Not sure how this will affect SpaceX, the article mentions them but thought they used the Ku-band spectrum?

http://spacenews.com/satellite-sector-mulls-how-to-live-with-fccs-5g-decision

Quote
The U.S. regulatory decision that denied protected status to satellite systems that have been investing in Ka-band spectrum, and cast doubt about the viability for satellite systems of other slices radio spectrum, has been met with a curiously muted response by the satellite sector.


Offline Robotbeat

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #983 on: 07/23/2016 01:32 pm »
Does the Ettus referred to in the filing refer to https://www.ettus.com/  ?

Looks like it does, and lends some weight to Robotbeat's idea earlier, or you could say his idea supports that it does, although the question might remain whose radio will be the final answer.

They will use some fairly off the shelf radios, but the final birds will be far more advanced and will almost certainly contain a huge amount of custom equipment.
It's not really my "idea." I just googled the radios liste in their FCC application.
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Offline HIP2BSQRE

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #984 on: 07/23/2016 11:15 pm »
SpaceX has stated that there maybe 6 - 8 demo satellites.  When do we think that the rest of them will launch?  Do we think that SpaceX will launch a pair every 6 months and keep making version changes eg this is version 1.0.  In 6 months they will launch version 1.1  - with a little more capability and so on?  Is 6 months enough time to evaluate, build, test a new version?

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #985 on: 07/28/2016 03:53 pm »
To update, over the last two months, SpaceX's Seattle office appears to have grown about 20%, with most of that growth roughly happening in the last month.  At least 111 employees.

SpaceX's web site shows about 45 positions open in the Seattle office, so they are still hiring (with some of those 45 positions maybe already filled and part of the 111+ employee figure above).

SpaceX's Irvine office appears to be very small.  A handful of open positions are shown on SpaceX's web site.

To update, over the last two months, SpaceX's Seattle office appears to have grown about 15%, with almost all of that growth from mid-March to Mid-April.  At least 91 employees.

SpaceX's web site shows about 55 positions open in the Seattle office, so for sure they are hiring (with some of those 55 positions maybe already filled and part of the 91+ employee figure, above).

SpaceX's Irvine office still seems very small.  Unclear from overall LinkedIn search whether it has even been opened.  But I note that SpaceX's web site shows a handful of positions open at the Irvine office.

Offline AncientU

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #986 on: 07/28/2016 06:49 pm »
To update, over the last two months, SpaceX's Seattle office appears to have grown about 20%, with most of that growth roughly happening in the last month.  At least 111 employees.

SpaceX's web site shows about 45 positions open in the Seattle office, so they are still hiring (with some of those 45 positions maybe already filled and part of the 111+ employee figure above).

SpaceX's Irvine office appears to be very small.  A handful of open positions are shown on SpaceX's web site.

To update, over the last two months, SpaceX's Seattle office appears to have grown about 15%, with almost all of that growth from mid-March to Mid-April.  At least 91 employees.

SpaceX's web site shows about 55 positions open in the Seattle office, so for sure they are hiring (with some of those 55 positions maybe already filled and part of the 91+ employee figure, above).

SpaceX's Irvine office still seems very small.  Unclear from overall LinkedIn search whether it has even been opened.  But I note that SpaceX's web site shows a handful of positions open at the Irvine office.

That's roughly a tripling per year rate.  If they maintain it, early 2017 staffing should be approaching 250 employees.  Also, if they maintain it, they'll surely have growing pains. 

Wonder if this group has sole responsibility for testing the prototype spacecraft heading to orbit this year?
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Online FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #987 on: 07/28/2016 07:13 pm »
Quote
SpaceX keeps constellation options open. 2 sats-inclination 86.6°, circular 625km orbit-get US FCC regs approval; must launch by Aug 2018.

https://twitter.com/pbdes/status/758734560330780673

Offline acsawdey

Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #988 on: 08/24/2016 12:11 am »
SpaceX apparently requisting FCC to create a different bond category for applicants for broadband satellite systems. Looks like the bonds are meant to keep people from claiming spectrum and not doing anything with it, you forfeit the bond amount if you haven't started using it by the deadline.

https://www.federalregister.gov/articles/2016/08/18/2016-14800/comprehensive-review-of-licensing-and-operating-rules-for-satellite-services

Quote
We will also retain the current bond amounts of $3 million for GSO system licenses and $5 million for NGSO system licenses as the final payment amounts potentially due under the escalating bond. We will not adopt SpaceX's suggestion to create a separate bond category for “NGSO broadband satellite systems.”

From the source pdf here https://apps.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/FCC-15-167A1.pdf we can see what SpaceX was asking for:

Quote
Most commenters on the issue oppose any increase in the bond amounts
above current levels. 208 Two parties, however, advocate increasing the bond amounts in some fashion. 209
Supporting an escalating bond requirement, Boeing suggests that the bond start at a value of $1 million,
and increase by $1 million each year if the licensee does not demonstrate compliance with optional
interim milestones. 210 SpaceX proposes a scaled bond approach for “NGSO broadband satellite systems”
that varies by the size of the system: $5 million for systems of 1-99 satellites; $10 million for systems of
100-999 satellites; and an additional $5 million for each additional 1,000 satellites. 211 Intelsat opposes
reducing the initial bond payment amount for GSO system licensees from the current $3 million value,
arguing that doing so could permit entities to obtain a license that are unable or unwilling to construct,
launch, and operate the proposed satellite. 212

I would read this as saying they don't want other proposers of large systems to park on the spectrum without paying a sizeable penalty. If they want 4000 sats, the bond would be $25m.

Offline docmordrid

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #989 on: 08/24/2016 05:10 am »
An anti-squatting rule makes sense. Otherwise you could end up with paralysis via gamesmanship by entrenched interests.
DM

Offline savuporo

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #990 on: 09/11/2016 12:54 am »
Does the Ettus referred to in the filing refer to https://www.ettus.com/  ?
It refers to Ettus USRP X310 SDR kit

Also, 19kw "Antenna would be on roof of Tesla Motors facility. Antenna itself is less than 3 meters tall. This antenna is for the Ku-band uplink.",  Fremont, 45500 Fremont Blvd :)
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Offline cscott

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #991 on: 09/11/2016 02:37 am »
Perhaps not on the top of the SpaceX building due to the solar farm already up there?

Offline savuporo

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #992 on: 09/11/2016 02:44 am »
Perhaps not on the top of the SpaceX building due to the solar farm already up there?

No they have multiple antennaes. In Redmond and Hawthorne too
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Offline vaporcobra

Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #993 on: 09/11/2016 03:24 am »
I wonder if the 1.66m^2 is the solar array?

That would give ~330w of power.

The other item is that the statement about 2 arrays (radio), is that 1 array for ground link and the other for sat to sat? Or 2 arrays, an up and downlink simplifying the receiver / transmitter arrangement?

It's talking about 2 solar arrays. Attachement 7 is an analysis of debris risk and how long the satellites will stay in orbit.  Solar array area looks to be 6x0.4=2.4m^2.  Huge difference in time to deorbit if the solar arrays fail to deploy (39 years instead of eight).  Also said these test satellites won't have propulsion or pressure vessels.  Attachment 7 can be found on this page: https://apps.fcc.gov/oetcf/els/reports/ViewExhibitReport.cfm?id_file_num=0356-EX-PL-2015&application_seq=66082.  (Some of the "Informal Objection" documents are a hoot.)

I suspect that like Planet's Flock satellites, SpaceX will try to rely on solar pressure for general station-keeping and positioning. This would almost certainly offer a drastic decrease in cost and complexity, just as is needed for mass production to be realistically doable.

Offline vaporcobra

Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #994 on: 09/11/2016 03:31 am »
I didn't read anything about the imagers before. Sounds like a fancy description of a gopro to be honest..

Don't forget that entire companies (Planet, Terra Bella, Planetary Resources, Deep Space Industries, Spire Global, etc.) currently exist for the purpose of providing hyperspectral imagery with quick (<24 hours) refresh rates. Even if SpaceX were to put a 1-3m/pixel resolution camera on every tenth or twentieth satellite of the several thousand purportedly planned, it would likely result in something on the order of hourly imagery of nearly the entire surface of the Earth. And that imagery already has a proven market value and demand :)
« Last Edit: 09/11/2016 09:14 pm by vaporcobra »

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #995 on: 09/30/2016 02:42 pm »
To update, over the last two months, SpaceX's Seattle office appears to have grown about 11%, with most of that growth occurring in August.  At least 123 employees.

SpaceX's web site shows 60 positions open in the Seattle office, so it appears that the intended hiring pace has not slowed (with some of those 60 positions maybe already filled and part of the 123+ employee figure above).

SpaceX Irvine office appears to be very small.  7 open positions are shown on SpaceX's web site.

To update, over the last two months, SpaceX's Seattle office appears to have grown about 20%, with most of that growth roughly happening in the last month.  At least 111 employees.

SpaceX's web site shows about 45 positions open in the Seattle office, so they are still hiring (with some of those 45 positions maybe already filled and part of the 111+ employee figure above).

SpaceX's Irvine office appears to be very small.  A handful of open positions are shown on SpaceX's web site.

Offline MikeAtkinson

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #996 on: 09/30/2016 02:46 pm »
Quote

Jeff Foust
‏@jeff_foust
Musk: we do have plans for a satellite constellation that could help to fund Mars; now is not the time to talk about it. #IAC2016
[/.quote]

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #997 on: 09/30/2016 03:03 pm »
Seems to me that it's full STEAM ahead on the SpaceX Satellite Network, with a bit of a head fake from Gwynne Shotwell.  ;)

To put in context, there are 60 positions listed on SpaceX's web site for Seattle and 200 for Hawthorne.
« Last Edit: 09/30/2016 03:12 pm by RedLineTrain »

Offline watermod

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #998 on: 10/01/2016 06:59 am »
Any idea as to the likely mass of one of these sats?    I am curious as I suspect 2 ITS flights could lot a networks of these.

Offline RedLineTrain

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Re: SpaceX - now a satellite manufacturer (Starlink)
« Reply #999 on: 10/01/2016 08:26 pm »
Re SpaceX's effort, compare to OneWeb.  LinkedIn shows 144 employees, so more or less the same as SpaceX.  But the types of employees are quite different.  Much more engineer-heavy at SpaceX.
« Last Edit: 10/01/2016 08:29 pm by RedLineTrain »

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