QuoteQuote from: MattMason on Today at 12:49 PMQuoteQuote from: Ben the Space Brit on Today at 10:53 AMWow! This thing is huge inside! It could definitely be used as an expendable Orbital Module for free-flying Dragon-2 missions with modular mission equipment arranged around the hub struts!Right! While BEAM was meant as a unique test design, it doesn't mean it cannot be adapted for more. The special compacting "Bloomin' Onion" length-expansion version of BEAM is different than the "artery stint" widening expansion of the larger module concepts like the 330, but flexibility is literally and figuratively not a problem, it seems.I can imagine combining two BEAM-like habitats, with mating devices on each end, to form a larger space. It could be moved anywhere. Clearly easy to get into orbit on any Dragon, but it's missing the assembling element.That's where we need something like that Lockheed Jupiter tug.Change the business end from a CBM to a 'docking' adaptor and you eliminate the need for the 'robot arm'.
Quote from: MattMason on Today at 12:49 PMQuoteQuote from: Ben the Space Brit on Today at 10:53 AMWow! This thing is huge inside! It could definitely be used as an expendable Orbital Module for free-flying Dragon-2 missions with modular mission equipment arranged around the hub struts!Right! While BEAM was meant as a unique test design, it doesn't mean it cannot be adapted for more. The special compacting "Bloomin' Onion" length-expansion version of BEAM is different than the "artery stint" widening expansion of the larger module concepts like the 330, but flexibility is literally and figuratively not a problem, it seems.I can imagine combining two BEAM-like habitats, with mating devices on each end, to form a larger space. It could be moved anywhere. Clearly easy to get into orbit on any Dragon, but it's missing the assembling element.That's where we need something like that Lockheed Jupiter tug.
Quote from: Ben the Space Brit on Today at 10:53 AMWow! This thing is huge inside! It could definitely be used as an expendable Orbital Module for free-flying Dragon-2 missions with modular mission equipment arranged around the hub struts!
Arm is still needed to get it out of the trunk
Why does it have to be BEAM type?. There are many threads on inflatable modules.
the development of it is already a 'sunk cost' and thus less of a risk that starting something from scratch.
BEAM is a prototype used to gain experience/confidence/flight history.There's no point in such otherwise. Very likely "one of a kind".The benefits of inflatables increase with size, so BEAM itself represents the least benefit possible.Follow on vehicle, if there's one, will be considerably larger, more versatile in application as a hab, and likely able to address more applications than just being a temporary wart on the side of the ISS.Again, hardware is crafted around a specific mission purpose to fulfill, not the other way around.
Can't recall if Orion is using IDA,
so it could also have BEAM-sized or far larger modules it could pull out of a payload adapter on an SLS flight.
I think my brain and understanding of the tech won't keep up with anything more than a Dragon-styled mission, so I'll just lurk if we go down the Orion or even Starliner road.
Jim has heavily inferred of other products aside from Bigelow but I'm showing my ignorance as to what they are for a compact habitat/workspace.
Perhaps we might define some notional missions where small habitats could or would be used?
I don't assume that "international" really meant that in terms of the IDA. Haven't we've gone through two previous "international" docking adapters during the Russian/US space-love fest that really weren't? What do the Soyuz use on their ISS modules?
Yes, I'm still moving the cart sideways with the horse, if not before. A living space does not a mission make. Nor, it appears, did I define what I'd imagine it'll be used for. Cargo? Supply missions needed to fill it. Habitation? How much room for crew? Duration? Shielding? Redundancies? Uh, what's needed for the mission itself?I get all that. It's clear that one defines a mission, and then designs the hardware or applies what you have, as noted so many times.
My mind was engaged, for no other reason other than how BEAM was delivered, with a BEAM-style volume stored and used for some wacky SpaceX project. But they aren't into the lunar scene for now.
Orion would require a lot more volume for a lengthy mission, and there's still the matter of what the mission requires, and habitation is one of many things as you inferred.As I opined in another thread on going to the moon in eight years, I don't see a government caring about or seriously funding a manned lunar mission.
If anyone's going to the moon, it'll be a lot of private businesses, leveraging the work of the private spaceflight groups to establish a construction beachhead for building commercial habitats for hotels and other space tourism. In that mode, BEAM-style modules could be attached on a central node for a lunar orbital waystation, used for storage, habitats. I think they are too small for use on the moon if there's means to drop down larger modules.
But perhaps I continue to wistfully imagine without keeping to the fact that volume is just empty space, pressurized or not. Something has to fill it to make it useful, which takes resources. In that case, Boeing has the upper hand in delivering hard-modules that have much of what is required.So, I get it, even as a mere enthusiast. I'm pondering the possibilities of the BEAM-sized habitat--just as some in NASA pondered Big Gemini. Might seem cool--might not be the best option to fulfill the mission objective.
Not necessarily. They can be installed in self-deploying 'flower petals' inside the pressure vessel and/or along the hub struts. The inflation gas tanks, ECLSS and power system could be fitted in a small 'service module' on the other side of the hub from the docking port; this would initially remain locked to the Falcon-9 upper stage until the pressure vessel is inflated and stable. It would then be detached and towed clear by the Dragon before the U/S performs its deorbit manoeuvre.
The best practical use I can think for something the size of BEAM would be an airlock for use on a vehicle such as Dragon or Orion and possible Dream Chaser on solo missions that require EVA.Most other missions it's either too small or for missions similar to the spacelab and spacehab missions during the shuttle program it needs to already be filled with equipment which would defeat the purpose of an expandable module.
Such a BEAM mobile airlock can have an NASA Docking System on one end and a door to the outside on the other. It could be a simple door or a pair of suit ports.When not being used the mobile docking port can be left at a spacestation, permitting reuse.
I think you've identified a role there for BEAM 2 - as a demonstrator for suitport technology.
Quote from: Bob Shaw on 06/19/2016 05:56 pmI think you've identified a role there for BEAM 2 - as a demonstrator for suitport technology. Why does that need to be demonstrated with a inflatable? and how would it be done since new suits that use suitports would be required.
A none inflatable airlock that will fit in the Dragon's trunk would need designing from scratch.As for the suitport technology demonstration - they are probably the part of NASA paying for the flight.
Quote from: A_M_Swallow on 06/20/2016 03:28 amA none inflatable airlock that will fit in the Dragon's trunk would need designing from scratch.As for the suitport technology demonstration - they are probably the part of NASA paying for the flight.Non sequitur. Any airlock supporting suitport technology " would need designing from scratch." BEAM does not provide any advantage.Again, another non sequitur. There are no new suits, therefore no suitport technology demonstration and hence no part of NASA paying for anything.This isn't happening in the next 5 years and so it is senseless talking about how it could happen with present day groups and hardware.
The development of the Z2 Spacesuit must have slipped then.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z_series_space_suits
Quote from: A_M_Swallow on 06/20/2016 08:58 pmThe development of the Z2 Spacesuit must have slipped then.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z_series_space_suitsIt isn't for the ISS but for planetary exploration, which for NASA is at least a decade away. NASA is using a different suit for the asteroid mission.