Quote from: demofsky on 06/22/2015 06:45 am...I can't recall anyone doing any deliberate modulation/pulsing of the power input so I want to highlight this for everyone's consideration.(I am catching up on this thread so apologies for the late question for this post.)Paul March from NASA discussed frequency, amplitude and phase modulation produced by the Magnetron in NSF EM Drive Thread 2. He showed the results of Dr. White's computer analysis (based on his QV theory) to the effect that the modulation provided by the Magnetron should result in much greater thrust as per White's theory. Therefore they designed a series of tests to be run with Magnetron providing modulation, that are scheduled to be run this Summer.
...I can't recall anyone doing any deliberate modulation/pulsing of the power input so I want to highlight this for everyone's consideration.(I am catching up on this thread so apologies for the late question for this post.)
Quote from: rfmwguy on 06/22/2015 02:54 pm...Sorry, thrust estimate in the 185 mg range I believe is what the spreadsheet said...snarky comment accepted What formula are you using to estimate the thrust force as 185 mg and what were the input parameters you used for the formula?
...Sorry, thrust estimate in the 185 mg range I believe is what the spreadsheet said...snarky comment accepted
...I'll have to go back and look at home, believe its travellers spreadsheet.edit...here it is: N thrust calculator derived from T = 2DfPoQ/c Q 50,000 Cavity Q 1.884 mN thrustPo 8 Watts input 1.884 mN thrustDf 0.7059 Design Factor 0.19 gf
Quote from: rfmwguy on 06/22/2015 03:11 pm...I'll have to go back and look at home, believe its travellers spreadsheet.edit...here it is: N thrust calculator derived from T = 2DfPoQ/c Q 50,000 Cavity Q 1.884 mN thrustPo 8 Watts input 1.884 mN thrustDf 0.7059 Design Factor 0.19 gfA lot depends on the Q and the validity of the formula, of course. If Q=5,000, the force is 1/10 of the calculated value. If Q=1,000 then it is 1/50 of the calculated value.
...I like being able to get into the cavity to change the Microwave antenna and the endplates plus being able see inside the maelstrom of microwave cavity activity might prove to be a plus. ..
Quote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm...I like being able to get into the cavity to change the Microwave antenna and the endplates plus being able see inside the maelstrom of microwave cavity activity might prove to be a plus. ..This is looking like it is going to be the best designed EM Drive test ever performed !I will not be surprised if you see plasma inside the EM Drive, I look forward to seeing the experiment !The RF feed location looks very important, based on aero's MEEP analysis.Am I reading you correctly that you will have the ability to change the RF feed location at will by being able to get into the cavity?
Quote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 03:53 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm...I like being able to get into the cavity to change the Microwave antenna and the endplates plus being able see inside the maelstrom of microwave cavity activity might prove to be a plus. ..This is looking like it is going to be the best designed EM Drive test ever performed !I will not be surprised if you see plasma inside the EM Drive, I look forward to seeing the experiment !The RF feed location looks very important, based on aero's MEEP analysis.Am I reading you correctly that you will have the ability to change the RF feed location at will by being able to get into the cavity? Yep. That's a affirmative. I think this might be one of the lesser looked at and talked about aspects of the EMDrive. I have a dear friend who is a ham and my ex was as well (and had so many different antenna designs, smart man. I'm sorry he has passed on as he would have Loved this!) so by tech osmosis I'm a little up on antennas, have a local brain to pick, as on here. I think it would be critical to be able to change the position as well as the shape.With so much up in the air as to the why it does what it does I didn't want to lock myself into having no or little flexibility in the testing in cavity shape and antenna designs.Shell
@ Dr. Rodal -Attached are images of the Brady cavity and the Rodal cavity showing antenna location. Are you sure you want to place the antenna where EW had theirs placed? Before you answer that, take a look at the field patterns here:Brady_corner_anthttps://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B1XizxEfB23tfjBKSFF2dFp4WVV2MEZzNUtOU3NmdTZrQWd0dVo4WFIxcll0NDZEUjFXeEk&usp=sharingand here:Rodal_corner_anthttps://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B1XizxEfB23tfjkxdTdaWjdxMmdLZ0syUktiaU9hSklYQmFGbzdkZGVtc09GRFB4ZzJTZ1k&usp=sharingAdd: Anyone interested in the EM thruster, feel free to check them out. -aero
Quote from: aero on 06/22/2015 04:02 pm@ Dr. Rodal -Attached are images of the Brady cavity and the Rodal cavity showing antenna location. Are you sure you want to place the antenna where EW had theirs placed? Before you answer that, take a look at the field patterns here:Brady_corner_anthttps://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B1XizxEfB23tfjBKSFF2dFp4WVV2MEZzNUtOU3NmdTZrQWd0dVo4WFIxcll0NDZEUjFXeEk&usp=sharingand here:Rodal_corner_anthttps://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B1XizxEfB23tfjkxdTdaWjdxMmdLZ0syUktiaU9hSklYQmFGbzdkZGVtc09GRFB4ZzJTZ1k&usp=sharingAdd: Anyone interested in the EM thruster, feel free to check them out. -aeroI cannot access the links in your above message. I get a screen stating "Permission required"I could access the link you sent me previously in a personal message for the other runs.What is the "Rodal cavity" ?
Quote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 04:12 pmQuote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 03:53 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm...I like being able to get into the cavity to change the Microwave antenna and the endplates plus being able see inside the maelstrom of microwave cavity activity might prove to be a plus. ..This is looking like it is going to be the best designed EM Drive test ever performed !I will not be surprised if you see plasma inside the EM Drive, I look forward to seeing the experiment !The RF feed location looks very important, based on aero's MEEP analysis.Am I reading you correctly that you will have the ability to change the RF feed location at will by being able to get into the cavity? Yep. That's a affirmative. I think this might be one of the lesser looked at and talked about aspects of the EMDrive. I have a dear friend who is a ham and my ex was as well (and had so many different antenna designs, smart man. I'm sorry he has passed on as he would have Loved this!) so by tech osmosis I'm a little up on antennas, have a local brain to pick, as on here. I think it would be critical to be able to change the position as well as the shape.With so much up in the air as to the why it does what it does I didn't want to lock myself into having no or little flexibility in the testing in cavity shape and antenna designs.ShellYou may also find the field patterns I linked above, interesting. I was surprised to see that the antenna location had such a dramatic effect, but on thinking about it I wonder why I didn't realize that would happen.
Quote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 04:12 pmQuote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 03:53 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm........Yep. That's a affirmative. I think this might be one of the lesser looked at and talked about aspects of the EMDrive. I have a dear friend who is a ham and my ex was as well (and had so many different antenna designs, smart man. I'm sorry he has passed on as he would have Loved this!) so by tech osmosis I'm a little up on antennas, have a local brain to pick, as on here. I think it would be critical to be able to change the position as well as the shape.With so much up in the air as to the why it does what it does I didn't want to lock myself into having no or little flexibility in the testing in cavity shape and antenna designs.ShellSo for all the microwave gurus, what is the expected effect of a hexagonal as opposed to circular cross-section?
Quote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 03:53 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm........Yep. That's a affirmative. I think this might be one of the lesser looked at and talked about aspects of the EMDrive. I have a dear friend who is a ham and my ex was as well (and had so many different antenna designs, smart man. I'm sorry he has passed on as he would have Loved this!) so by tech osmosis I'm a little up on antennas, have a local brain to pick, as on here. I think it would be critical to be able to change the position as well as the shape.With so much up in the air as to the why it does what it does I didn't want to lock myself into having no or little flexibility in the testing in cavity shape and antenna designs.Shell
Quote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm........
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Quote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 04:12 pmQuote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 03:53 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm...I like being able to get into the cavity to change the Microwave antenna and the endplates plus being able see inside the maelstrom of microwave cavity activity might prove to be a plus. ..This is looking like it is going to be the best designed EM Drive test ever performed !I will not be surprised if you see plasma inside the EM Drive, I look forward to seeing the experiment !The RF feed location looks very important, based on aero's MEEP analysis.Am I reading you correctly that you will have the ability to change the RF feed location at will by being able to get into the cavity? Yep. That's a affirmative. I think this might be one of the lesser looked at and talked about aspects of the EMDrive. I have a dear friend who is a ham and my ex was as well (and had so many different antenna designs, smart man. I'm sorry he has passed on as he would have Loved this!) so by tech osmosis I'm a little up on antennas, have a local brain to pick, as on here. I think it would be critical to be able to change the position as well as the shape.With so much up in the air as to the why it does what it does I didn't want to lock myself into having no or little flexibility in the testing in cavity shape and antenna designs.ShellSo for all the microwave gurus, what is the expected effect of a hexagonal as opposed to circular cross-section?
...Its the Brady cavity extended (same taper) to small end diameter of 25% of the big end diameter. The long one in the images attached above.I don't know why you can't click the links - I can. But then maybe Google remembers my computer. Does anyone else have a problem getting access to my Google drive data linked?The linked folders contain complete sets of images, 16 cycles every 0.2 cycles. Here is one.
Quote from: Prunesquallor on 06/22/2015 04:25 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 04:12 pmQuote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 03:53 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm........So for all the microwave gurus, what is the expected effect of a hexagonal as opposed to circular cross-section?Field wise, I do not know, thermal wise, a potential for some thermal focus along the seams, but this is going to be way interesting! Nice call Shell...
Quote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 04:12 pmQuote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 03:53 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm........So for all the microwave gurus, what is the expected effect of a hexagonal as opposed to circular cross-section?
Quote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 03:53 pmQuote from: SeeShells on 06/22/2015 03:38 pm........
Quote from: Rodal on 06/22/2015 04:21 pmQuote from: aero on 06/22/2015 04:02 pm@ Dr. Rodal -Attached are images of the Brady cavity and the Rodal cavity showing antenna location. Are you sure you want to place the antenna where EW had theirs placed? Before you answer that, take a look at the field patterns here:Brady_corner_anthttps://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B1XizxEfB23tfjBKSFF2dFp4WVV2MEZzNUtOU3NmdTZrQWd0dVo4WFIxcll0NDZEUjFXeEk&usp=sharingand here:Rodal_corner_anthttps://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B1XizxEfB23tfjkxdTdaWjdxMmdLZ0syUktiaU9hSklYQmFGbzdkZGVtc09GRFB4ZzJTZ1k&usp=sharingAdd: Anyone interested in the EM thruster, feel free to check them out. -aeroI cannot access the links in your above message. I get a screen stating "Permission required"I could access the link you sent me previously in a personal message for the other runs.What is the "Rodal cavity" ?Its the Brady cavity extended (same taper) to small end diameter of 25% of the big end diameter. The long one in the images attached above.I don't know why you can't click the links - I can. But then maybe Google remembers my computer. Does anyone else have a problem getting access to my Google drive data linked?The linked folders contain complete sets of images, 16 cycles every 0.2 cycles. Here is one.
Time to start my build.