Author Topic: SpaceLogistics MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : GEOsat servicing  (Read 69396 times)

Offline oldAtlas_Eguy

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https://www.orbitalatk.com/space-systems/human-space-advanced-systems/vivisat/docs/FS011_15_OA_3862%20ViviSat.pdf


Orbital believes that there is a  business case  closure for servicing GEOSATS. I wonder if Orbital has been quietly adding to their sat buss design easy prop transfer connections between platforms? If they have then they would have a straight forward system to do prop transfer between Orbital manufactured sat buss. supposedly they are spending real development funds for a GEO sat buss derived repair vehicle that hosts some of the Cygnus avionics and software for automated rendezvous.

So this tread is to explore the questions:

Capabilities of the vehicle?

Will it be able to service Orbital manufactured only sat buss or any sat buss?

How will the repair/service be paid? By the operator or by the insurer? (Opinion: Use of the same model for repair claims as the auto  industry where if repair costs more than the "total loss" pay out then repair would not be paid for.)


http://spacenews.com/orbital-atk-believes-in-satellite-servicing-but-not-in-rocket-reusability/

Will the business case close? How is the business case closure accomplished?

« Last Edit: 03/16/2023 02:08 pm by gongora »

Offline Oli

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I'm very skeptical.

Boeing's 702SP platform satellites for example only need 5kg of xenon per year for station keeping. I can't see refueling making economic sense.

Offline baldusi

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SES has been talking about this a bit. They see refuel+new instrument missions as secondaries on full fledged GEO missions.
Apparently, they would send one of their birds with a "parasite" module. The main sat would get as close as reasonable to the old sat, release the module, and continue to its final position. The module would self dock with the big bird.
It will require the satellite not only to have propellant access, but also data, thermal and power hooks for the new payload and have surplus control authority. I bet that OrbitalATK can be an excellent partner for this sort of system.

Offline Chalmer

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Sounds like lots of exciting things are happening in OrbitalATK.

With regards to the satellite in-orbit servicing, it sounds like it is mostly refueling for telecom sats in geo orbit, and maybe some simple repairs. And that they already have one or more anchor costumers.

How this will work, i have no idea. Can you refuel a satelite that was not designed to be refueled?

In the article they state that they expect to begin in 2019. That would suggest satelites already in orbit today.

Does anyone with insight into the operations of geo orbit telecom satelites know what value extra fuel would have for satelites already in orbit, and in position? I know they need fuel for station keeping. But would access to regular refueling add something more than longer lifespan (can station keep for more years)?

Im looking forward to hearing more details later this year from OrbitalATK.
« Last Edit: 03/02/2016 04:27 pm by Chalmer »

Offline Bynaus

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Quote
Apparently, they would send one of their birds with a "parasite" module.

But then - why not just equip the satellite with a tank the size of the parasite module? Sure, you can't refuel the old ones that way, but then at least the new ones could simply skip rueling themselves... (at less overall complexity) I don't really see how a "parasitic" solution makes sense.

If at all, a separate vehicle should do the refueling. If the extended life-times of the refueled sats are more worth than the cost of this vehicle, you're good.
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Offline MattMason

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It's clear that older satellites couldn't make this work, and that geo-sats are often designed with economy to help them last for a decade.

But could such refueling or service make them last longer? Or, with advances to technology, would extra longevity actually make them less practical to maintain?

As an I.T. guy, I encounter this dilemma often with customers that bring in a five, six, even 10 year old printer or computer that needs minor maintenance that has otherwise worked fine. The cost of labor to perform such maintenance, in addition to feature creep that has antiquated the device and decreased the number of genuine, non-refurbished parts or supplies makes upkeep far less practical in terms of functionality than giving the old device a good Christian burial and buying a new one.

You can't upgrade your geo-sat with a new one every 3 years, but you probably shouldn't spend a buttload of dough on servicing an 10 year old one unless it Really Pays Off for results or it's a one of a kind device. The Hubble Space Telescope comes to mind here.

If upgrading could be practical, the device needs to be configured from the start for this and an infrastructure with a service vehicle built for satellites in mind. I think Lockheed had built the Jupiter with this in mind.

EDIT: wrong word
« Last Edit: 03/02/2016 04:44 pm by MattMason »
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Offline TrevorMonty

DARPA are working towards having large GEO  platforms which host current satellite  payloads. OrbitalAtK  repair satellites are a step in this direction of large platforms.  Whether OA  build or own platform or just the build and fit payloads remains to be seen. These large GEO communication platforms could lead on to space  solar power stations. If SSP happens it will be a trillion dollar industry in which OA will want to be involved.

Offline starchasercowboy

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What if??  Say the James Webb telescope has a problem after it's deployment, could this servicing vehicle observe the exterior, aid in a plan to repair, if it is equipped with an arm, maybe it could do a repair.  Didn't one of Lockheed's satellites AEHF kick motors fail a couple years ago and had to rely on its Hall effect thruster to raise the apogee. 

Offline Sam Ho

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What if??  Say the James Webb telescope has a problem after it's deployment, could this servicing vehicle observe the exterior, aid in a plan to repair, if it is equipped with an arm, maybe it could do a repair.  Didn't one of Lockheed's satellites AEHF kick motors fail a couple years ago and had to rely on its Hall effect thruster to raise the apogee.

That was AEHF-1, which made it to GEO despite the apogee motor failure, but whose in-service date was delayed by about 8 months.  In that particular case, you probably couldn't put together a servicing mission and launch it in less time than the satellite took to get to GEO on its own with stationkeeping thrusters.

http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2012/11/aehf-2-handed-usaf-after-completing-on-orbit-testing/

From the Orbital conference call, Dave Thompson gives a very high-level description of the servicing module.
Quote
Based on the Orbital legacy Geostar Satellite Platform and our Cygnus Autonomous Rendezvous technology, together with the ATK heritage Hubble space telescope servicing devices and other prior work. The first of these new geosynchronous orbit servicing vehicles if the project proceeds as expected will commence operations following launch in early 2019.

Details on this project including anchor customer agreements and the technical capabilities of our servicing systems will be announced later this year.

Later on, he mentions that this will be privately funded:
Quote
At present, there is not and we do not anticipate government contribution to the space initiative. That is a new commercial service that we are preparing to offer and while over the long-term, government satellites may benefit from it and make use of it, we don't expect government funding during the development phase of that project.

Offline jhnphm

The article is probably referring to this:

https://www.orbitalatk.com/space-systems/human-space-advanced-systems/vivisat/docs/FS011_15_OA_3862%20ViviSat.pdf

The idea is to extend the lifetime of existing satellites by acting as their station keeping thrusters, then reuse the extension vehicle on other satellites when the client satellites are decommissioned. No refueling, unlike the MDA concepts.

Offline baldusi

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #10 on: 03/03/2016 01:01 pm »
Again, from SES presentation, they state very clearly that the issue is payload obsolescence. Current satellites have a 20 year design life. The can do them upto 20kW. With SEP stationkeeping they can have more than enough operative propellant. What's that any good if in 10 years you are offering a very slow and expensive service because you can't offer the improved waveshapes? Or if today you have to use fixed signal strength but in 10 years your competitors can distribute power according to demand?
There's a reason SES talked about payload. And there's a reason they talked about sending new payloads on already scheduled missions. Not only a new payload can be done a lot cheaper (you don't need IMU, suntracker, APE, etc.), but you don't actually add missions. You use the same ground segment, you still do LEOPs as usual. You just add a bit of work to your ground team and the launch services cost is just incremental. Orbital ATK opportunity is so good because they have a lot of experience not only on the GEO side, but on RV operations. A GEO designed to tackle new payloads would have not only a special design, but also the necessary beacons and targets to make it very easy for the "parasite" payload to catch it. In fact, the new GEO sat might release it nearby and the old GEO sat might go and catch it. It's not like it would need a lot of incremental capabilities.

Offline Stan-1967

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #11 on: 03/07/2016 01:52 am »
Interesting video.   So basically it's a life extension service inclusive of propulsion & stationkeeping.   So yes, it's target market seems to be sats nearing obsolence, and likely targeted for replacement.   I guess OA thinks the business case closes, that there is enough value to extending life vs. replacement.   

Online catdlr

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #12 on: 04/11/2016 11:52 pm »
updated video that was previously pulled from YouTube:

Satellite Mission Extension Services
BY: Orbital ATK

Published on Apr 11, 2016
Orbital ATK's satellite life extension services employs our Mission Extension Vehicle (MEV) which autonomously rendezvous and docks with the customer satellite to provide additional propulsion and attitude control.

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Offline Kryten

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #13 on: 04/12/2016 09:00 pm »
 Orbital have secured Intelsat as an anchor customer for this service, and have started production on the first MEV, with launch set for late 2018.
http://www.orbitalatk.com/news-room/release.asp?prid=137
Quote
Dulles, Virginia and Luxembourg 12 April 2016 – Orbital ATK, Inc. (NYSE: OA), a global leader in aerospace and defense technologies, today announced that Intelsat, S.A. (NYSE: I), operator of the world’s first Globalized Network, has signed a contract to become the first customer for Orbital ATK’s new satellite life extension service. [...] Under the agreement, Orbital ATK will manufacture, test and launch the first Commercial Servicing Vehicle (CSV), the Mission Extension Vehicle-1 (MEV-1), which incorporates flight-proven technologies the company has used in its commercial satellite and space logistics businesses.  After successfully completing a series of in-orbit tests, the MEV-1 will begin its mission extension service for Intelsat in 2019.

Offline rayleighscatter

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #14 on: 04/12/2016 11:14 pm »
I wonder if the MEV is small/light enough for launch on a Pegasus?

EDIT: At 2,000kg it looks like they'd have to go to a third party launcher.
« Last Edit: 04/13/2016 12:47 am by rayleighscatter »

Offline synchrotron

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Offline Kryten

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #16 on: 04/13/2016 06:49 pm »
I wonder if the MEV is small/light enough for launch on a Pegasus?

EDIT: At 2,000kg it looks like they'd have to go to a third party launcher.
The video gives it as being directly inserted to GTO, so I'd expect lower payload slot on Ariane 5 for single launches (although Antares could do it). From the video and fact sheet it seems to be set up to allow dual launch without an adaptor, so they're probably looking at Falcon 9 in future.

Offline Sam Ho

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #17 on: 04/13/2016 08:47 pm »
Jeff Foust writes about this in SpaceNews.

First launch is planned for 2018, with a test docking to an Intelsat satellite in a graveyard orbit, followed by 5 years on an active Intelsat satellite.  On the business side, it's now an OA subsidiary called Space Logistics; the Vivisat joint venture is gone, on account of lack of external funding.  OA is hoping to build 5 in 5 years.

http://spacenews.com/orbital-atk-signs-intelsat-as-first-satellite-servicing-customer/

Offline Kryten

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #18 on: 05/03/2016 11:37 pm »
 US Space are suing OrbATK over the dissolution of the Vivisat sat joint venture; http://spacenews.com/u-s-space-sues-orbital-atk-over-vivisat-venture/

Offline Sam Ho

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #19 on: 05/09/2016 10:28 pm »
Some information from the quarterly earnings conference call May 5:
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/edited-transcript-oa-earnings-conference-200923610.html
Quote
As another example in our Space Systems group, we announced in April, a five-year contract with Intelsat, the first customer for our in-space commercial satellite servicing system. This program is a great example of the new revenue opportunities created by our merger as we combine the Orbital legacy GEOStar satellite platform and Cygnus Autonomous Rendezvous technology with ATK Heritage Hubble telescope servicing devices and other prior work. If things proceed as planned, the first of an eventual fleet of up to five of these geosynchronous orbit servicing vehicles will commence operations following launch in early 2019, with four more such vehicles to follow in 2020 and 2021.

Offline savuporo

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #20 on: 05/10/2016 07:33 am »
It will require the satellite not only to have propellant access, but also data, thermal and power hooks for the new payload and have surplus control authority. I bet that OrbitalATK can be an excellent partner for this sort of system.

This is the part that i don't get. How do you 'hook' into data and power bus of a satellite, unless you have been building birds with this in mind for decades ?
The video even explicitly says 'no power, data, fluid transfer or other interfaces are required' - which i presume applies only to the docking part.
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Offline TrevorMonty

Here is presentation  about OA satellite  servicing, prior to Vivisat separation.

Jim Armor, Orbital ATK at the Space Innovation Business Summit" 2015



Besides extending an existing satellite life, it can also be used as space tug by moving satellites  to different orbits then releasing them. This allows satellite to move orbits without expending precious station keeping fuel.

Long term goals are servicing, repairing, refuelling  and inspecting satellites.  Mk1 service vehicle may already support inspections.

Hosted payloads allows for extra revenue, especially between jobs when service vehicle is free to point anywhere.

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Offline baldusi

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #22 on: 05/10/2016 01:18 pm »
It will require the satellite not only to have propellant access, but also data, thermal and power hooks for the new payload and have surplus control authority. I bet that OrbitalATK can be an excellent partner for this sort of system.

This is the part that i don't get. How do you 'hook' into data and power bus of a satellite, unless you have been building birds with this in mind for decades ?
The video even explicitly says 'no power, data, fluid transfer or other interfaces are required' - which i presume applies only to the docking part.
Please read the full context of my post. I was referring to SES vision for the future where they do include that sort of interfaces on every bird they send. Thus, each new satellite could take up new payloads for other crafts. This was SES vision of the future.
Orbital current mission proposal is more about propellant, attitude control and debris retirement.

Offline TrevorMonty

MUOS-5 could be a candidate for Orbital servicing satellite.

Offline kevin-rf

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #24 on: 07/09/2016 02:33 pm »
MUOS-5 could be a candidate for Orbital servicing satellite.


Isn't a little early since we do not yet know the cause of the anomaly, and if they can overcome/work around it?
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Offline baldusi

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #25 on: 07/09/2016 05:50 pm »
Specially since they are still on a GTO. That still requires a GTO circularizaton (~1,800m/s delta-v). And the GTO are usually low lived, so you can't take much time. So you'd need to have a bird ready to launch. I seriously doubt it.

Offline Sam Ho

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #26 on: 07/09/2016 06:35 pm »
Specially since they are still on a GTO. That still requires a GTO circularizaton (~1,800m/s delta-v). And the GTO are usually low lived, so you can't take much time. So you'd need to have a bird ready to launch. I seriously doubt it.
MUOS-5 had an unusual GTO (3903x35654km at 19 degrees) and an unusual operational orbit (IGSO at 5 degrees).  As such, both the initial GTO and its present orbit (15249x35710km at 10 degrees) have essentially infinite lifespans.  Also, the delta-V from GTO to final IGSO was only around 1300m/s; it's about halfway there right now.

http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=40693.0
http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=33818.0
http://www.heavens-above.com/orbit.aspx?satid=41622
http://www.n2yo.com/satellite/?s=41622
http://sattrackcam.blogspot.com/

Offline Archibald

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #27 on: 07/10/2016 08:02 am »
Satellite servicing is fascinating, but it has been discussed since the 60's. Maybe in today space boom it may have its chance, at last.
Satellite servicing is cool because it makes boring communication satellites interesting - they can be targets for hardware to support BEO exploration.
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Offline Sam Ho

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #28 on: 08/11/2016 12:37 am »
The big news in the OA conference call this quarter was the $400M accounting error on the US Army ammo contract, but there was some space news.  The in-orbit servicing schedule is pretty much the same as last quarter.
Quote
Our Space Systems Group early in the second quarter announced a five-year contract with Intelsat as the first customer for this satellite servicing system. Late in the second quarter, we completed a first system design review and placed long-lead material orders for the first of these satellite servicing vehicles, which is on track for delivery and launch in the final quarter of 2018; and after a checkout period, the commencement of service in the early 2019. Schedules, cost and the technical performance are proceeding as planned on that project at present.

Offline Sam Ho

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Offline TrevorMonty

This show has lot of information about OA satellite servicing.

http://www.thespaceshow.com/show/31-oct-2016/broadcast-2804-jim-armor

The 2700kg servicing vehicle is based on electric GEO satellite bus. Besides providing propulsion for sats, there are few ideas for using it.
1) deliver cubesats to GEO on its delivery launch.
2) carry technology demonstration payloads, these could be ejected once finished with.
3) rescue satellites stuck in GTO due to propulsion problems. Been a few of these cases. US govt and insurance companies might pay to have one that can launched at short notice, for this scenario.

4) in orbit refuelling. Long term goal.

5) a satellite doesn't need to hold fuel back for disposal to graveyard orbit if service vehicle can do it.

6) visual inspection of faulty satellites.

I was surprised to hear there was market for operational old satellites. Lease them out to customers that don't need latest broadcast technology at reduced price. Of course limited fuel was always issue, which service vehicles overcomes.




Offline Sam Ho

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #32 on: 11/08/2016 08:23 pm »
From the OA non-earnings conference call today:
Quote
And finally in our space systems group about earlier this year we announced a five-year contract with Intelsat, the first customer for our in space commercial satellite servicing system. We recently completed the designed review for the first servicing vehicle and secured a launch contract for it in late 2018.

If things proceed as planned, the first of an eventual fleet of up to five of these geosynchronous orbit servicing vehicles will commence operations in early 2019 followed by four more vehicles some with enhanced capabilities that will follow in 2020 and 2021.
http://seekingalpha.com/article/4021177-orbital-atks-oa-ceo-dave-thompson-q3-2016-results-earnings-call-transcript

Offline primer_black

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #33 on: 11/29/2016 03:16 pm »
Not sure if this should be a new thread, but OA is working with NASA to extend the MEV servicing capabilities to include on-orbit assembly:

http://www.orbitalatk.com/news-room/release.asp?prid=204

Quote
Dulles, Virginia 29 November 2016 – Orbital ATK (NYSE: OA), a global leader in aerospace and defense technologies, today announced that it has begun a public-private partnership with NASA’s Space Technology Mission Directorate (STMD) to establish a Commercial Infrastructure for Robotic Assembly and Services (CIRAS) in space. The CIRAS program will advance key technologies for in-orbit manufacturing and assembly of large space structures that will help the agency meet its goals for robotic and human exploration of the solar system.

...

Phase one of CIRAS began in September 2016 and will last a total of two years. During this period, Orbital ATK will lead the team in maturing technologies necessary for robotic assembly of large space structures, such as next-generation telescopes or solar-powered structures for transport or communications. These capabilities include methods to connect or disconnect joints on a structure and address precision measuring and alignment through a 15-meter robotic arm and a precision robot. The team will also develop the technology needed to conduct in-orbit modular assembly of structures, allowing parts to be brought to space as needed via multiple launches, which simplifies the design of spacecraft and reduces cost.

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #34 on: 01/26/2017 04:42 am »
MEV Mission Profile

Orbital ATK

Published on Jan 25, 2017
In less than a year after announcing its first customer contract, Orbital ATK has made significant progress in developing its new satellite life extension service. The innovative technology, a first in the industry, gives satellite operators the capability to extend the life of a healthy satellite. Orbital ATK remains on track to introduce its in-orbit satellite servicing system with the Mission Extension Vehicle-1 (MEV-1). The vehicle is currently under production at the company’s satellite manufacturing facility in Dulles, Virginia.



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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #35 on: 01/26/2017 04:43 am »
MEV Robotic Simulation

Orbital ATK

Published on Jan 25, 2017
See how our in-orbit mission extension vehicle (MEV), the industry's first, will work with this robotic simulation at our Rendezvous, Proximity Operations and Docking Laboratory in Dulles, Virginia.



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Offline Sam Ho

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #36 on: 05/30/2017 11:25 pm »
Some mention in the conference call May 11:
Quote
With regard to the satellite servicing program, the technical work is proceeding very well. The final design review of the system is coming up next month in June. We have set up a very helpful rendezvous and docking laboratory at our Dallas, Virginia satellite campus to test out both some of the docking hardware and also the control system software that we will be using, and things remain on track for the delivery to the launch site and the launch of the first satellite servicing vehicle at the end of next year. After a multi-month-long commissioning and checkout period, it will be placed into service to extend the life of Intelsat spacecraft in the -- about this time or a little earlier than this time in the first quarter of 2019. We are contemplating starting on a second servicing vehicle later this year. We haven't finalized those plans yet. But we continue to proceed along the lines of having a small fleet of up to 5 of these servicing systems in orbit by -- over the next 4, 5 years, some of which will have advanced capabilities, robotic capabilities beyond those of the first and second satellites. Customer demand for this type of in-space servicing continues to be good, and so the outlook is favorable for that new product initiative.

There's certainly customer demand now for those services beyond what can be provided by the first vehicle. So I think it's likely we'll see additional customer commitments before the end of 2017.
transcript

Offline Sam Ho

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #37 on: 08/04/2017 01:00 am »
Comments from today's earnings call:
Quote
Finally, in space systems early last year we initiated our commercial satellite servicing program with INTELSAT in Oregon to a five year contract as our anchor customer. Late last year we completed the initial design for the first vehicle we recently finalized the design that are now well into construction of that first mission extension vehicle that Garrett referred to. If things proceed as planned it will be the first of an eventual fleet of up to five of these geosynchronous orbit servicing vehicles this first one being launched late next year and commencing operations about 18 months from now in the early part of 2019.
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4094384-orbital-atks-oa-ceo-dave-thompson-q2-2017-results-earnings-call-transcript

Offline rayleighscatter

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #38 on: 08/10/2017 11:52 pm »
A pair of OA fact sheets. The first is about hosted payloads on the MEV spacecraft, and the second is about the CiRAS on orbit repair work.


Offline TrevorMonty

Fiso podcast on this robotic arm

http://spirit.as.utexas.edu/~fiso/archivelist.htm

18may16

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #40 on: 09/11/2017 02:37 pm »
Quote
Peter B. de Selding‏ @pbdes 2h2 hours ago

75% of components of 1st @OrbitalATK satellite Mission Extension Vehicle now built; system testing in spring; on track for late 2018 launch.

https://twitter.com/pbdes/status/907226437505167360

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #41 on: 09/13/2017 08:53 am »
Quote
Peter B. de Selding‏ @pbdes 4m4 minutes ago

Culbertson @OrbitalATK : We're about to sign 2d customer for Mission Extension Vehicle sat servicing program. [@Intelsat's 1st, in 2019].

https://twitter.com/pbdes/status/907889001109094400

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #42 on: 09/27/2017 09:20 am »
Quote
Michelle‏ @spacechelle 2m2 minutes ago

Space Logistics LLC, subsidiary of @OrbitalATK is poised to be first to launch their satellite servicing vehicle. Planned for 2018 #IAC2017

https://twitter.com/spacechelle/status/912969429436084227

Edit to add:

Quote
Jeff Foust‏ @jeff_foust 2m2 minutes ago

Tom Wilson, Space Logistics LLC: spending lot of time on regulatory issues for satellite life extension, but has been cooperative. #IAC2017

https://twitter.com/jeff_foust/status/912970036796465153
« Last Edit: 09/27/2017 09:22 am by FutureSpaceTourist »

Online gongora

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #43 on: 12/09/2017 05:19 pm »
SAT-LOA-20170224-00021

Quote
On December 5, 2017, the Satellite Division granted in part and deferred in part, with conditions, the request of Space Logistics, LLC for authority to construct, deploy, and conduct telemetry, tracking and command functions with its Mission Extension Vehicle-1 (MEV-1). Space Logistics was authorized to conduct TT&C operations in the 5925-6425 MHz and 13.75-14.5 GHz (Earth-to-space), and 3700-4200 MHz and 11.45-12.25 GHz (space-to Earth) frequency bands as MEV-1: (i) is deployed from the launch vehicle; engages in orbit-raising maneuvers and conducts various post-launch system verification tests, and moves through the geosynchronous transfer orbit (GTO); (ii) raises its orbit to the geostationary orbit "graveyard" orbit 300 km above the GSO orbital arc; and (iii) performs rendezvous, proximity operations, and docking with the Intelsat-901 space station (Call Sign S2405) in the graveyard orbit. Space Logistics' request to relocate MEV-1 with Intelsat-901 to the orbital location of another operational Intelsat satellite was deferred. Action on Space Logistics' request to relocate MEV-1 to a graveyard orbit at the completion of Intelsat-901's mission and to undock MEV-1 after de-commissioning of Intelsat-901 was also deferred.
« Last Edit: 12/09/2017 05:20 pm by gongora »

Offline jacqmans

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #44 on: 01/04/2018 01:07 pm »
Orbital ATK Receives Order for Second In-Orbit Satellite Servicing Vehicle

Intelsat Commits to Second Life Extension Mission

Dulles, Virginia 4 January 2018 – Orbital ATK (NYSE: OA), a global leader in aerospace and defense technologies, today announced it has been awarded a contract for a second Mission Extension Vehicle (MEV-2). The vehicle was ordered by Intelsat S.A. to provide life extension services for an Intelsat satellite. Orbital ATK is now producing MEV-1, the industry’s first commercial in-space satellite servicing system, for Intelsat with launch scheduled for late 2018. Under this new agreement, Orbital ATK will manufacture, test and launch MEV-2 and begin mission extension services in mid-2020. The production of the second MEV is part of Orbital ATK’s longer-range plan to establish a fleet of in-orbit servicing vehicles that can address diverse space logistics needs including repair, assembly, refueling and in-space transportation.

“Work on MEV-1 is progressing rapidly toward a late 2018 launch with system-level testing beginning this spring,” said Tom Wilson, President of Orbital ATK’s Space Logistics, LLC subsidiary. “With the launch of MEV-2, Orbital ATK will continue to pioneer in-space satellite servicing for commercial operators. Intelsat’s commitment to a second MEV demonstrates not only the market demand for our servicing vehicles, but also the customer’s confidence in our product.”

Through its Space Logistics subsidiary, Orbital ATK will introduce in-orbit commercial satellite servicing with MEV-1 late this year. The MEV is based on the company’s GEOStarTM spacecraft platform, and controlled by the company’s satellite operations team. The MEV uses a reliable, low-risk docking system that attaches to existing features on a customer’s satellite, and provides life-extending services by taking over the orbit maintenance and attitude control functions of the client’s spacecraft. Each MEV vehicle has a 15 year design life with the ability to perform numerous dockings and repositionings during its life span.

“Intelsat was an early proponent of the potential for mission extension technology,” said Ken Lee, Intelsat’s Senior Vice President, Space Systems. “In-orbit life extension, such as that provided by our two contracts with Orbital ATK, provides additional flexibility to our fleet management, allowing us to direct capital to new satellites while continuing to generate economic value from satellites in orbit. We look forward to our continued collaboration with Orbital ATK on commercializing this important new service.”

The work performed on MEV-2 will span multiple locations across the company. Orbital ATK’s spacecraft components division will be responsible for manufacturing the structures, propellant tanks and solar arrays at the company’s locations in San Diego and Goleta, California. The Rendezvous, Proximity Operations and Docking (RPOD) laboratory, located at the company’s headquarters in Dulles, Virginia, will test the sensors, actuators and control algorithms that allow the MEV to approach and dock with the client spacecraft.

Orbital ATK plans to expand its satellite servicing capabilities to address additional in-orbit needs of customers. The company is investing significant internal capital and, through a NASA Space Act Agreement, working with U.S. government agencies to develop and implement new capabilities for the MEV fleet. These include next-generation life extension and repair vehicles, in-orbit assembly of large space structures and cargo delivery and related services to deep space gateways, such as in lunar orbit.

Offline Tomness

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #45 on: 01/27/2018 08:02 pm »
with the launch anomaly with SES-14 &  AL YAH 3  (which is Orbital ATK Sat), could they launch MEV into direct insertion GEO to provide maximum MEV for these types of mission or slow and steady would be fine?

Offline Sam Ho

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #46 on: 01/30/2018 03:30 am »
with the launch anomaly with SES-14 &  AL YAH 3  (which is Orbital ATK Sat), could they launch MEV into direct insertion GEO to provide maximum MEV for these types of mission or slow and steady would be fine?
I'm not sure what you're proposing here.  SES-14 and Al Yah 3 are planning to relocate themselves to GSO using onboard propulsion at a cost of some of their normal stationkeeping propellant.  SES says it will cause them four weeks of delay to the on-orbit date, but that they should still meet the designed lifetime.  OA says Al Yah 3 will make it to GSO, but did not specify if the lifespan will be shortened.  SES-14 is all-electric and was originally slated for a Cape launch, and so probably has generous propellant margins.  Rough analysis suggests that getting from the VA241 orbit to GSO would cost around 3-5 extra years of stationkeeping propellant, minus whatever margin they launched with, so that's probably a worst-case estimate for Al Yah 3.  Given that VA241 was over 1700kg lighter than a typical Ariane 5 GTO mission, I would presume both spacecraft had their propellant tanks completely full.  Either way, neither satellite is likely to be a candidate for mission extension for a decade or more.

Offline TrevorMonty

By time they run low on few, OA will be offering refuelling, so only short visit by MEV will be required.


Offline primer_black

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #48 on: 01/30/2018 05:44 pm »
I suppose it's worthwhile to note that a satellite doesn't need to be running low on fuel to be a candidate for MEV services; the operator could simply wish to avoid early life fuel expenditures of a plane change, stationkeeping, or any other maneuvering.

I suppose it's moot though, as the supply of MEVs is currently limited and customers with near-empty tanks are likely to bid more to keep their birds flying.

Offline TrevorMonty

The two MEV orders are for fleet customers. I'm guessing customer owns or leases MEV for fix period, so it wouldn't be available for other customers unless they deal can be struck with current owner.

I can see case for insurance companies owning one, lease it out when not required. They may even be able to make profit on it while still never needing the MEV themselves.

DOD is another potential customer, given cost of their satellites a MEV would be cheap insurance.

While current version can only attach and move satellites, future version will add refuelling and limited repair. Current version should be able to do inspections, which is still valuable feature.
Refuelling is probable most important feature as all functional satellites could benefit from a topup.
« Last Edit: 01/30/2018 09:54 pm by TrevorMonty »

Online gongora

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #50 on: 02/09/2019 01:32 am »
SAT-AMD-20190207-00008

The MEV-1/IS-901 stack will be used to replace IS-907 at 27.5W orbital location.

Offline primer_black

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #51 on: 10/08/2019 04:35 pm »
Bout time to bump this thread with launch tomorrow, updates in the Russian Launcher section:

https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=41418.0

Offline jongoff

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #52 on: 10/08/2019 05:00 pm »
Bout time to bump this thread with launch tomorrow, updates in the Russian Launcher section:

https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=41418.0

Fingers crossed for NG and MEV. I've known a lot of the people involved on this program over the years (which started at Swales that got bought by ATK that got bought by Orbital that got bought by NG), and hope they're successful here. I'm not sure if this will be seen as the start of the era of commercial satellite servicing or not, but it would still be great for the industry to see them succeed.

~Jon

Offline primer_black

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Offline TrevorMonty

Spacenews article on this launch.

https://spacenews.com/northrop-grummans-satellite-servicer-mev-1-eutelsat-satellite-launch-on-ils-proton/

Another related article.

https://spacenews.com/industry-weighs-governments-role-in-satellite-servicing/

Some question economics of satellite servicing given future of current GEO sats is not looking good. I think MEV is just right right vehicle for these aging GEOsats, allows their operators to put off replacements in an uncertain future for GEOsats.

The most important part of MEV is proving that rendevous and capture of satellites is possible. Once satellites can be captured reliably it opens up lot possibilities, servicing, payload replacement/upgrades assuming satellite has quick fix connections, refuelling. Persistant platforms now become an option whether they are in LEO, GEO or lunar orbits.

Offline high road

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #55 on: 10/10/2019 09:12 pm »

Would the MEV also allow more expensive sats to be placed in LEO? If their orbit degradation can be reversed every so often by refueling them/pushing them to a higher orbit, by way of a relatively cheap MEV. These sats might have completely different instruments, or far more sensitive instruments than the cheaper, mass produced LEO constellations. Is that a possible outcome, or doesn't that make any sense? (in which case, why?)

Offline Rondaz

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #56 on: 11/25/2019 11:11 pm »
MEV-1 - Northrop Grumman's Mission Extension Vehicle, launched Oct 9, has interrupted its move from super-synchronous orbit to GEO with no detectable thruster firings since Nov 19.

https://twitter.com/Zarya_Info/status/1199070952400838657

Offline russianhalo117

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #57 on: 11/26/2019 02:14 am »
MEV-1 - Northrop Grumman's Mission Extension Vehicle, launched Oct 9, has interrupted its move from super-synchronous orbit to GEO with no detectable thruster firings since Nov 19.

https://twitter.com/Zarya_Info/status/1199070952400838657
Well it does have to drift to its checkout point and then adjust to its first target.

Offline primer_black

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« Last Edit: 12/20/2019 05:26 pm by primer_black »

Offline TrevorMonty

https://twitter.com/SpcPlcyOnline/status/1220475235234959360

Marcia Smith (@SpcPlcyOnline) tweeted at 11:35 AM on Fri, Jan 24, 2020:
Northrop Grumman tells us "MEV-1 spacecraft remains in good health as it continues an orbit-raising mission for a planned rendezvous and docking with its client satellite. We are targeting this event for early February."

« Last Edit: 01/24/2020 01:13 am by zubenelgenubi »

Offline starbase

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #60 on: 02/03/2020 10:04 am »
Quote
Intelsat 901 and MEV-1 have matched orbits
Unknown how close they are to each other but probably in the tens of km, tracking sensors may be having difficulty separating them

https://twitter.com/Zarya_Info/status/1223552289820086272
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Offline starbase

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #61 on: 02/10/2020 10:41 pm »
Quote
Check out these captures using Canada’s NEOSSat and Sapphire satellites, as we assist in tracking the in-orbit  docking experiment of the Northrop Grumman MEV-1 with Intelsat 901 in support of our Five-Eyes partner nations and the Phantom Echoes team.
https://twitter.com/CanadianForces/status/1226986044068900864
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Offline starbase

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #62 on: 02/19/2020 08:10 am »
Quote
The distance between the two satellites is now less than 50 km.
https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1228049662088749056
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Offline starbase

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #63 on: 02/23/2020 03:29 pm »
Quote
No news from @northropgrumman or @INTELSAT but...

MEV-1 is sitting about 2 km from Intel 901, having closed the gap slowly over the past two weeks
https://twitter.com/Zarya_Info/status/1231518525828816896
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Offline starbase

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #64 on: 02/26/2020 08:06 am »
Quote
The @northropgrumman MEV-1 satellite has now been within 5 km of its Intelsat 901 target for over a week.  The detailed wiggles in this noisy plot based on the TLEs are not real but it gives an overall idea that the two sats remain close

There has been no public statement by @northropgrumman on the status of the mission, but my understanding is that there may already have been several aborted approaches. I'd guess it may take them another week or so to dock successfully.

The Fri 21 excursion might be a signature of an aborted approach and retreat followed by a re-approach
https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1232309173171474433

https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1232357732415459328
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Offline Olaf

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #65 on: 02/26/2020 05:29 pm »
https://twitter.com/northropgrumman/status/1232729546383859714

Quote
History in the making: Our MEV-1 has successfully docked with the @INTELSAT  IS-901 satellite in orbit – a first for the industry. http://ngc.com/mev

Offline Mammutti

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #66 on: 02/26/2020 05:51 pm »
https://twitter.com/thesheetztweetz/status/1232736703431020546

Quote from: Michael Sheetz
These are photos taken by MEV-1 as it approached the IS-901 satellite and then docked, with Earth visible in the background of the second and third images.


Offline eeergo

That's wonderful, and not just for servicing - it's probably already making materials performance engineers drool to be able to see up close, detailed images of a commercial, industry-standard GEO commsat exposed in an operational environment for almost 20 years.

Mindbending to finally see a deployed GEO bird with Earth on the background without it being a render.

Anybody has any pre-launch pictures of IS-901 handy? EDIT: OK, DutchSpace provided, as usual :)


https://twitter.com/DutchSpace/status/1232735071850975234
« Last Edit: 02/26/2020 06:10 pm by eeergo »
-DaviD-

Offline Kaputnik

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #68 on: 02/26/2020 06:20 pm »
An incredible achievement, congratulations to OrbitalATK.
Would I be correct in thinking that this is the first time that two spacecraft have docked outside LEO since Apollo?
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Offline zubenelgenubi

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #69 on: 02/26/2020 08:17 pm »
https://twitter.com/ChrisG_NSF/status/1232731234574520320

Quote
History! northropgrumman has successfully docked their Mission Extension Vehicle to INTELSAT-901 in Geostationary graveyard orbit.  901 will now enjoy 5 years of prolonged telecommunications life.
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2020/02/northrop-grumman-history-mission-extension-vehicle-docks-satellite/
« Last Edit: 02/26/2020 08:18 pm by zubenelgenubi »
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Offline DavidH

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #70 on: 02/27/2020 02:29 am »
An incredible achievement, congratulations to OrbitalATK.
Would I be correct in thinking that this is the first time that two spacecraft have docked outside LEO since Apollo?
No. Search for Orbital Express.

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Offline gemmy0I

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #71 on: 02/27/2020 04:40 am »
An incredible achievement, congratulations to OrbitalATK.
Would I be correct in thinking that this is the first time that two spacecraft have docked outside LEO since Apollo?
No. Search for Orbital Express.
Thanks for the pointer, I had no idea anything that ambitious (orbital refueling of hydrazine + battery and computer swaps with a robotic arm) had actually been done before!

According to Wikipedia, though, it seems Orbital Express only went to LEO (490km x 498km x 46.0 degrees). So today's MEV-1 docking may indeed be the first docking outside LEO since Apollo (unless there's another robotic satellite servicing mission in the history books I'm not aware of! :) ).

Offline eeergo

Animation of the (kinda probe-and-drogue) docking sequence.

https://twitter.com/_elbertina/status/1232753393342521346
-DaviD-

Offline Kaputnik

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #73 on: 02/27/2020 12:16 pm »
An incredible achievement, congratulations to OrbitalATK.
Would I be correct in thinking that this is the first time that two spacecraft have docked outside LEO since Apollo?
No. Search for Orbital Express.
Thanks for the pointer, I had no idea anything that ambitious (orbital refueling of hydrazine + battery and computer swaps with a robotic arm) had actually been done before!

According to Wikipedia, though, it seems Orbital Express only went to LEO (490km x 498km x 46.0 degrees). So today's MEV-1 docking may indeed be the first docking outside LEO since Apollo (unless there's another robotic satellite servicing mission in the history books I'm not aware of! :) ).

Also launched both spacecraft on the same launcher, like Apollo, so MEX-1 is, I think, the only docking outside of LEO where the two spacecraft were separately launched.
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Online gongora

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I merged in a small thread for the second MEV and retitled the thread so that it's not just for MEV-1.

NGIS got their FCC license approved for MEV-2: SAT-LOA-20191210-00144
MEV-2 will be launching NET June (probably later due to the current global situation).

Offline Mammutti

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #75 on: 04/08/2020 02:15 pm »


Quote from: Northrop Grumman
Our Mission Extension Vehicle made history when it docked to Intelsat’s IS-901 satellite. This animation features real images from the February 25 docking. Learn more here: ngc.com/mev

Offline Olaf

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #76 on: 04/11/2020 08:07 am »
https://twitter.com/TSKelso/status/1248651792826560521

Quote
IS-901 & MEV-1 have slotted back into GEO this week next to IS-907 at 27.5 W.

Offline FutureSpaceTourist

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #77 on: 04/17/2020 01:36 pm »
Quote
For the first time ever, a robotic spacecraft caught an old satellite and extended its life
PUBLISHED FRI, APR 17 20209:18 AM EDT
Michael Sheetz
@THESHEETZTWEETZ

KEY POINTS

A small spacecraft built by Northrop Grumman succeeded in docking with Intelsat’s IS-901 satellite and returning it to service for another five years.

The feat is a space industry first, as extending the life of spacecraft already in orbit has only been done with human help before.

“Intelsat is proud to have pioneered this innovative first with Northrop Grumman,” the company’s chief services officer Mike DeMarco said in a statement.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/17/northrop-grumman-mev-1-spacecraft-services-intelsat-901-satellite.html
« Last Edit: 04/17/2020 01:38 pm by FutureSpaceTourist »

Offline jacqmans

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #78 on: 04/17/2020 03:02 pm »
Intelsat 901 Satellite Returns to Service Using Northrop Grumman’s Mission Extension Vehicle

Combined spacecraft stack now fully operational as companies demonstrate advantages of satellite life-extension service
 Space • MEV-1 

April 17, 2020

MCLEAN and DULLES, Va. – April 17, 2020 – Intelsat (NYSE: I) today announced that Intelsat 901 has returned to service following the successful docking with the first Mission Extension Vehicle (MEV-1) from Northrop Grumman Corporation (NYSE: NOC) and the company’s wholly-owned subsidiary, SpaceLogistics LLC, on February 25 – the first time that two commercial spacecraft docked in geostationary orbit.

Since the February rendezvous, MEV-1 has assumed navigation of the combined spacecraft stack reducing its inclination by 1.6° and relocating IS-901 to its new orbital location. Intelsat then transitioned roughly 30 of its commercial and government customers to the satellite on April 2. The transition of service took approximately six hours. IS-901 is now operating at the 332.5°E orbital slot and providing full service to Intelsat customers.

Intelsat views life-extension services, like MEV technology, as a cost-effective and efficient way to minimize service disruptions, enhance the overall flexibility of its satellite fleet and better support the evolving needs of its customers.

“With a focus on providing the best customer experience in our industry, Intelsat is proud to have pioneered this innovative first with Northrop Grumman. We see increased demand for our connectivity services around the world, and preserving our customers’ experience using innovative technology such as MEV-1 is helping us meet that need,” said Intelsat Chief Services Officer Mike DeMarco. “I want to thank Northrop Grumman, SpaceLogistics and our valued Intelsat customers, who put their trust in us to successfully execute this historic mission. As commercial space-servicing technology progresses, Intelsat looks forward to pioneering new applications in support of our customers’ continued success.”

“Our partnership with Intelsat was critical to delivering this innovative satellite technology into operation,” said Tom Wilson, vice president, Northrop Grumman Space Systems and president, SpaceLogistics, LLC. “This historic event, highlighted by the first in-orbit rendezvous and docking of two commercial satellites and the subsequent repositioning of the two-spacecraft stack, demonstrates the business value that MEV offers to customers. Now that MEV-1 has successfully delivered on its mission to place the Intelsat 901 satellite back into operational service, we will continue to pioneer the future of on-orbit servicing through our multi-year technology roadmap leading to additional services such as inspection, assembly and repair.”

Under the terms of the contract, Northrop Grumman and SpaceLogistics will provide five years of life extension services to IS-901 before returning the spacecraft to a final decommissioned orbit. MEV-1 will then be available to provide additional mission extension services for new clients including orbit raising, inclination corrections and inspections. Intelsat has already also contracted with Northrop Grumman for a second MEV (MEV-2) to service Intelsat 1002 satellite later this year.

https://news.northropgrumman.com/news/releases/intelsat-901-satellite-returns-to-service-using-northrop-grummans-mission-extension-vehicle
Jacques :-)

Offline TrevorMonty

Fiso podcast on MEV and future servicing vehicles.

http://fiso.spiritastro.net/telecon/Anderson_5-6-20/


Here is video of MEP (mission extension pod) and MRV in operation. The MEP is low cost version of MEV and relies on MRV to attach it to satellite. MEP can fly as secondary on GTO missions can also be used to resupply MRV with tools and I'm assuming fuel, especially if they expand into satellite refuelling.



Edit few more bits from podcast.
Fridge size MEP wet mass 300kg, will give 2000kg sat (typical dry end of sat) 6yr extension. Customer owns MEP, assume they control it via NGIS network. MEP can be moved between satellites using MRV.

Geosat range from 1000-3500kg  MEP life will vary depending size.
Currently 10-15 Geosats retire every year due to lack of fuel, so significant market for  MEP.

While not stated, current Geo market is in state of flux with move from satellite TV to internet TV. The MEP allows customers to keep earning revenue from perfectly functional satellite while avoiding spending few $100m replacing it especially with uncertain future.
A 15yr sat has well a truely paid for its self so extra 5yrs for cost of MEP is good investment. No pricing on MEP but given its size I'm guessing $20-30m launched and attached.

Their MRV design is still not locked down, considering using MEP to refuel it. I think NGIS prefer adding extra external tank with generic interface, this is aim for customer satellites. Want future satellites built with this in mind and USB type port to add extras eg replacement reaction wheel module.
« Last Edit: 05/08/2020 02:10 am by TrevorMonty »

Offline edzieba

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #80 on: 06/30/2020 05:21 pm »
That's a very odd architecture. The MEPs already contain their own propulsion, power, and capture mechanism and are able to independently manoeuvre to match the target satellite orbit. Beyond needing to add the visual positioning system to the MEPs, the MRV seems to be entirely redundant. Even with the worlds most expensive dual-redundant  time-of-flight imagers, it seems unlikely that adding that imaging system to all the MEPs would cost more than would be gained by eliminating the MRV entirely and adding one or more MEPs (and paying customers) to each launch, - and eliminating development of an additional spacecraft.

Offline TrevorMonty

That's a very odd architecture. The MEPs already contain their own propulsion, power, and capture mechanism and are able to independently manoeuvre to match the target satellite orbit. Beyond needing to add the visual positioning system to the MEPs, the MRV seems to be entirely redundant. Even with the worlds most expensive dual-redundant  time-of-flight imagers, it seems unlikely that adding that imaging system to all the MEPs would cost more than would be gained by eliminating the MRV entirely and adding one or more MEPs (and paying customers) to each launch, - and eliminating development of an additional spacecraft.
The systems for capturing satellite are very expensive , heavy and require lot of extra manoeuvring thrusters. MEV is likely to have redundant systems while low cost expendable MEP may not have any redundancy. If it fails MEV removes it from satellite and delivers to disposal orbit.

Think of MEP as extra fuel tank and engine for satellite. Trying to keep it cheap and light as possible with only enough systems to deliver it to GEO.

NGIS may use same approach with Artemis cryogenic transfer element.  Use cut down version minus service module as OTV, with MEV used to capture it and deliver payload to final destination. Much like tug is used for helping ship berth.




Offline TrevorMonty

https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2020/07/mission-extension-vehicles-validate-lifeline/

https://twitter.com/TGMetsFan98/status/1286738291430174732
MEV could extend Hubble space telescope life. May even be able to bring it within range of ISS so it could be serviced by crew vehicle.

Offline Steven Pietrobon

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #84 on: 07/25/2020 06:05 am »
MEV could extend Hubble space telescope life. May even be able to bring it within range of ISS so it could be serviced by crew vehicle.

The inclination difference would require a huge change in delta-V, which makes that impractical. Reality is nothing like the movie "Gravity".
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline Ronsmytheiii

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #85 on: 07/25/2020 07:03 am »
MEV could extend Hubble space telescope life. May even be able to bring it within range of ISS so it could be serviced by crew vehicle.

The inclination difference would require a huge change in delta-V, which makes that impractical. Reality is nothing like the movie "Gravity".

It is interesting though that the MEV could eventually have precise enough control to take over pointing for Hubble, since that requires a very high degree of precision. Might also make it a good bus for future telescope payloads, or even earth observing payloads.

Offline Star One

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #86 on: 07/25/2020 02:18 pm »
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2020/07/mission-extension-vehicles-validate-lifeline/

https://twitter.com/TGMetsFan98/status/1286738291430174732
MEV could extend Hubble space telescope life. May even be able to bring it within range of ISS so it could be serviced by crew vehicle.
It would be easier to bring it in range of a Dragon 2 capsule for example flying on a dedicated service mission.

Offline gemmy0I

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #87 on: 07/25/2020 05:22 pm »
MEV could extend Hubble space telescope life. May even be able to bring it within range of ISS so it could be serviced by crew vehicle.

The inclination difference would require a huge change in delta-V, which makes that impractical. Reality is nothing like the movie "Gravity".
This got me thinking, though - how much delta-v would such a plane change require? (I don't really know how to do the calculation myself short of firing KSP in RO and trying it out, which I'm not presently set up to do...)

MEV is designed to provide a lot of delta-v over its many-year lifespan, including raising itself from GTO to GEO (at least 1500 m/s in the "ideal" case of launching from an Ariane 5 to a 0-degree GTO, but more like 1800-2000 m/s if launched from the Cape or from Baikonur, as the first one did), then providing station keeping service for several years with a heavy satellite attached.

IIRC, GEO comsats typically budget about half of their delta-v for the raise from GTO->GEO and the other half for stationkeeping over their typically 10-15 year lifespan. That means in the ballpark of ~2000 m/s to station-keep a GEO satellite for as long as MEV is designed to (accounting for the fact that it's to do multiple 5-year job increments on different satellites).

Electric propulsion complicates delta-v calculations a bit since it normally forces the satellite to take a less efficient trajectory, but going off my Kerbal experience at least, I don't think that would matter as much for an inclination change (not if it's done as a straight inclination change, without raising/lowering the orbit), since the Oberth effect doesn't really help with that anyway.

On the other hand, Hubble is pretty heavy (11,110 kg per Wikipedia) compared to GEO comsats, especially comparing to the dry mass of the comsat which is more representative of what it looks like at the end of its inbuilt propulsive life when MEV takes over.

All of this is to say, moving Hubble to the ISS's inclination would certainly be a prodigious delta-v expenditure, but MEV should have a decent amount of that in stock, so I'm not sure which would "win out". I imagine the MEV would be fully or nearly depleted in such a case, meaning it does the inclination change and then is done (perhaps requiring a second vehicle to be sent to maintain ongoing station-keeping).

This would definitely be expensive, but it would be small potatoes compared to the costs of past Hubble servicing missions - and the benefits of moving it to an inclination where crew missions can be staged from the ISS or commercial successors could be quite substantial. Besides allowing servicing to be performed cheaply "on the side" of ISS crew missions (vs. requiring dedicated launches), it would allow crew to take refuge at the ISS in the event of a contingency - a major concern for the last Shuttle Hubble mission (STS-125 which required the STS-400 rescue shuttle to stand by on the pad). That may be less of a concern for e.g. Dragon since it doesn't have the Shuttle's heat shield/foam strike woes, but NASA is once burned, twice shy, so I could see them really appreciating the flexibility.

Doing this with Northrop's more advanced modular/pod-based successors to MEV would make the equation even more attractive by permitting the vehicle's delta-v to be easily scaled up. MEV is a relatively small bird relative to the capabilities of today's launchers (especially if launched solo, and to LEO as it would be for Hubble), so it'd be smart to increase the fuel load at launch. Modular fuel pods would also allow it to be refueled again and again to provide Hubble station-keeping for decades. (And at the ISS's inclination, those pods could even be piggybacked as unpressurized cargo on an ISS cargo launch.)

I do feel obliged to point out (because if I don't, someone else will :) ) that this could all be moot in an era of cheap daily reusable Starship launches, which could readily be performed to any inclination. The rescue/staging advantages of being in the ISS's inclination are far less if another Starship can be called up on short notice to Hubble's inclination. Still, the plane change would be a one-time expense, and not a huge one at that by Hubble standards. 51.6o is likely "the place to be" for future successors to the ISS (for several reasons*), i.e. anything in that same inclination is "more valuable real estate" than elsewhere in terms of human spaceflight and EVA servicing potential.

*The reasons I suspect the ISS's commercial successors will end up sharing its 51.6o inclination include:

1. International accessibility - a high inclination is required to reach it from Baikonur. (This is why the ISS is at that inclination in the first place, as was Mir before it.) Russia right now seems to be more interested in cooperating with the Chinese going forward but they're still involved at ISS and I can't imagine NASA would want to "freeze them out" from future participation in any case.

2. Easy/cheap travel between stations. ISS will likely have some overlap with its commercial successor(s) before it's retired, and I'm sure NASA would really, really like to be able to ferry people and supplies between them during that overlap without requiring a new launch. Historically, this was done during the Salyut 7/Mir overlap and was planned for Mir/ISS (but forestalled by ISS delays which kept it from launching until after Mir's reentry).

3. Permitting land touchdowns of capsules in the continental U.S. When Space Station Freedom was in the works prior to becoming the ISS, it would have been at the 28.5o Canaveral inclination. NASA contemplated buying Soyuz capsules from the Russians for escape pods, but would've had to launch them (unmanned, two at a time) in the Shuttle's payload bay since Soyuz couldn't reach that inclination (at least pre-Kourou); and because the orbit's ground track only passes over the southern tips of the continental U.S., they had to consider landing in the Australian Outback because a parachuting capsule like Soyuz needs a wide open space to target. (Trying to land in Florida or South Texas would have risked a splashdown if it went at all off course.) This isn't a problem for Dragon or Orion, but it would be a problem for Starliner. (Dream Chaser, like the Shuttle, does precise runway landings so it doesn't have this problem.) Having the ISS at 51.6o opens up a lot more options for land landings, and that would remain true for commercial successors - probably outweighing the delta-v cost vs. 28.5o, which can be easily paid by today's powerful rockets (unlike Shuttle which had to undergo extensive lightening).

Offline TrevorMonty

I didn't really look into Hubble orbit inclination when suggesting idea.

They are planning for MEV to be refuelled, wth MEP being used to resupply MEVs. 

Online Coastal Ron

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #89 on: 07/25/2020 08:07 pm »
Just read the NSF article and got up to date with what has been happening. I remember when it was proposed I was thrilled we'd finally be able to test out this concept, and it looks like it is a winner!

Of course we're talking about peaceful uses for this technology, but there are non-peaceful ones too that hopefully never come to pass.

There is a negative side effect, which is that the market for new satellites might see a decline. Oh well, TINSTAAFL.   ;)
If we don't continuously lower the cost to access space, how are we ever going to afford to expand humanity out into space?

Offline primer_black

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #90 on: 07/26/2020 02:06 am »
I didn't really look into Hubble orbit inclination when suggesting idea.

They are planning for MEV to be refuelled, wth MEP being used to resupply MEVs.

Not quite, the plan is for a more capable ‘MRV’ (built in partnership with DARPA RSGS)  to install inexpensive, mini ‘MEPs’ on client vehicles at a much lower price point than affected When tying up the entire attention of an MEV for the duration of a client life extension.

Offline Steven Pietrobon

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #91 on: 07/26/2020 09:10 am »
A single burn delta-V from 28.5 to 51.6 degrees is 2*7.7*sin((51.6-28.5)/2) = 3.1 km/s, the same as that required for trans Lunar injection!
« Last Edit: 07/26/2020 09:12 am by Steven Pietrobon »
Akin's Laws of Spacecraft Design #1:  Engineering is done with numbers.  Analysis without numbers is only an opinion.

Offline Hog

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #92 on: 07/26/2020 03:44 pm »
A single burn delta-V from 28.5 to 51.6 degrees is 2*7.7*sin((51.6-28.5)/2) = 3.1 km/s, the same as that required for trans Lunar injection!
Excellent factoid!
A shuttle Orbiter Vehicle with a full OMS pods fuel load had a total delta V capacity of 300 m/s(1000 fps) with the OV carrying a 29,484kg/65,000 pound payload.  While STS-107 used a 39º inclination and not a 28.5º orbit, your maths  helps to illustrate just how unattainable reaching the safe-haven of the ISS for safe was for the STS-107 mission, even if anyone had indeed known that there was a problem with the TPS of Columbia.
Paul

Offline TrevorMonty

I didn't really look into Hubble orbit inclination when suggesting idea.

They are planning for MEV to be refuelled, wth MEP being used to resupply MEVs.

Not quite, the plan is for a more capable ‘MRV’ (built in partnership with DARPA RSGS)  to install inexpensive, mini ‘MEPs’ on client vehicles at a much lower price point than affected When tying up the entire attention of an MEV for the duration of a client life extension.
Their range of inspace products and services will only increase if TE for landers is built. This will give them high performance hydrolox OTV with option of adding MRV robotics.


Offline gemmy0I

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #94 on: 07/27/2020 05:30 pm »
A single burn delta-V from 28.5 to 51.6 degrees is 2*7.7*sin((51.6-28.5)/2) = 3.1 km/s, the same as that required for trans Lunar injection!
Good to know, thanks!

Especially given Hubble weighs so much more than the average GEO comsat, I would guess that this puts the plane change out of the range of a standard MEV. I do wonder if it would be any more feasible with the "pods" architecture NG is developing, though. If the pods essentially represent dockable fuel tanks, then several of them could be aggregated to provide enough cumulative delta-v for the whole plane change.

The trick would be ensuring that all the fuel/delta-v can be launched in a single launch - because the telescope/MEV would be a "moving target" during the plane change, eliminating the logistical advantages MEV relies on in GEO, namely, frequent launches to that destination and the ability to "hop" from satellite to satellite with minimal delta-v. So it would be easiest to just launch MEV pre-loaded with all the propellant needed to do the whole plane change. Since xenon ion propulsion is so efficient, I suspect this might actually be feasible. Let's do the math...

Specific impulse for ion thrusters seems to vary considerably across different designs, and I don't know what MEV's is, so I'll pick 2000 s out of thin air as a (hopefully) conservative ballpark estimate. Hubble masses 11,110 kg (all dry mass since it has no propulsion). I couldn't find any public numbers for MEV's dry mass (or even launch mass), but it's probably fair to assume its dry mass is in the ballpark of 3000 kg (conservatively), given the configurations NG has been launching them in. Let's round up and say that comes to a total of roughly 14,500 kg dry mass for the combined Hubble+MEV complex. (That would mean 3390 kg dry for just MEV. That's probably a lot heavier than a real MEV, but it's safer to round up here since this would be a "heavy" MEV loaded with extra fuel, requiring extra tankage.)

Now we can solve for the propellant mass of xenon needed to achieve a 3.1 km/s plane change:

delta-v = Isp * 9.8 m/s^2 * ln(wet mass / dry mass)
3100 m/s = 2000 s * 9.8 m/s^2 * ln((14,500 kg + x)/14,500 kg)
x = 2484.7 kg

...which makes for a total launch mass of (3390 kg + 2485 kg) = 5875 kg.

In other words, to launch an MEV with sufficient propellant to complete the entire plane change without refueling, "all" we need is to modify MEV with some extra/bigger fuel tanks (which shouldn't be a major change given how modular the architecture seems to be; modularly adjusting propellant mass per-mission seems to be de rigeur for GEO comsat manufacturers), and find a launcher which can put ~6 tonnes into LEO. Nearly all medium-class launchers on the market can do this. A Falcon 9 could do it with over 10 tonnes capacity to spare, i.e. it could rideshare with other payloads.

In fact, adding another tonne or so of xenon would give the vehicle the ability to maintain normal Hubble station-keeping for years to come after the plane change, and would still leave loads of headroom for a rideshare on Falcon 9.

All told, the mission could probably be done for less than $250 million (including launch), accounting for the fact that this would be a bespoke MEV capable of docking to Hubble's unique docking port (LIDS, which is basically a "beta" spec of IDS and thus could use the docking system NG is developing for HALO with minimal modifications) and meeting any other requirements for taking over Hubble's precise station-keeping needs. This is assuming launch on a Falcon 9 for ~$50 million as a solo payload, which could be decreased further with a rideshare.

This is...surprisingly feasible. :) (Ion propulsion is cool!)

Edit: OK, maybe $250 million is a bit optimistic. I don't think there are any public figures on what a single MEV costs but since NG is planning to amortize the cost of each one over several customer servicing missions, perhaps it could be as high as $500 million for a bespoke one capable of meeting Hubble's unique needs. Still, that's cheap by Hubble servicing standards. I don't see the cost of adding the propellant for the plane change as factoring significantly into that cost vs. "just" making an MEV to take over Hubble station keeping in its current 28o orbit.
« Last Edit: 07/27/2020 05:33 pm by gemmy0I »

Offline edzieba

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #95 on: 07/27/2020 05:56 pm »
Would 'just' moving Hubble to the ISS' vicinity in order to repair and refurbish be sufficient for it to continue providing useful science, or would you then need to move it back to its prior orbit again? That would double mission costs for sending a second MEV (or at the very least, add several additional tons of Xenon to the super-MEV).

Offline gemmy0I

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #96 on: 07/27/2020 06:42 pm »
Would 'just' moving Hubble to the ISS' vicinity in order to repair and refurbish be sufficient for it to continue providing useful science, or would you then need to move it back to its prior orbit again? That would double mission costs for sending a second MEV (or at the very least, add several additional tons of Xenon to the super-MEV).
My understanding is that Hubble isn't in its current inclination because it's specifically desirable for science, but rather because it's the "cheapest" inclination to launch to from Canaveral. The Shuttle had so much dry mass that it was extremely limited in the orbits it could reach; back when Hubble was launched, it simply couldn't reach the ISS's 51.6o orbit. Several of the orbiters had to undergo extensive lightening, and the external tank had to be redesigned to use light-weight alloys, in order for them to reach that inclination for Shuttle-Mir (and subsequently ISS). IIRC, Challenger, the heaviest of the orbiters (having begun its life as a structural test article, as indicated by its low serial number, OV-099) wouldn't have been able to reach ISS/Mir if it had survived that long.

Today's vehicles being much more flexible in the orbits they can reach, these issues no longer dominate the equation, and I suspect if Hubble were launched today it would be put in a different orbit, probably 51.6o for easy servicing from ISS. The penalty for that orbit vs. 28.5o isn't that bad - it was just that the Shuttle was always riding the edge of its mass-to-orbit capacity and every m/s of delta-v counted dearly. At the time, the ISS didn't exist yet, so 28.5o was "the place to be" for optimal serviceability, as the Shuttle was the only game in town for that. That's no longer the case now that the Shuttle is retired and the ISS is now the focal point of LEO human spaceflight activity.

It's worth noting that when Hubble was under development, Space Station Freedom, before it became the ISS, was envisioned to be at 28.5o, since there was no need to reach it from Baikonur. Bringing Hubble to 51.6o would restore it to its originally envisioned accessibility.

Beyond that, I'm not really sure what would make a particular orbit more or less "desirable" for Hubble, but I'm pretty sure that changing its inclination to 51.6o, without changing any other orbital parameters, wouldn't change that.

The modern trend seems to be to send big space telescopes out to Earth-Sun L2 (e.g. JWST, Spektr-RG) so that they remain in a fixed position relative to the Sun and Earth, which apparently (my personal knowledge on this is fairly limited - this is per Wikipedia) can make "shielding and calibration...much simpler" because "an object around L2 will maintain the same relative position with respect to the Sun and Earth". But L2 is much more expensive to reach than LEO (JWST weighs ~6500 kg vs. Hubble's ~11000, and it's launching on a rocket better suited to high orbits than Shuttle, which had to rely on solid upper stages for that), so it wouldn't have been practical for something as big and heavy as Hubble (not to mention that it would have precluded Shuttle servicing flights). I get the impression that Hubble's current orbit was chosen as a practical compromise rather than for primarily scientific reasons.

Offline Hog

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #97 on: 07/28/2020 03:11 pm »
Would 'just' moving Hubble to the ISS' vicinity in order to repair and refurbish be sufficient for it to continue providing useful science, or would you then need to move it back to its prior orbit again? That would double mission costs for sending a second MEV (or at the very least, add several additional tons of Xenon to the super-MEV).
My understanding is that Hubble isn't in its current inclination because it's specifically desirable for science, but rather because it's the "cheapest" inclination to launch to from Canaveral. The Shuttle had so much dry mass that it was extremely limited in the orbits it could reach; back when Hubble was launched, it simply couldn't reach the ISS's 51.6o orbit. Several of the orbiters had to undergo extensive lightening, and the external tank had to be redesigned to use light-weight alloys, in order for them to reach that inclination for Shuttle-Mir (and subsequently ISS). IIRC, Challenger, the heaviest of the orbiters (having begun its life as a structural test article, as indicated by its low serial number, OV-099) wouldn't have been able to reach ISS/Mir if it had survived that long.

Today's vehicles being much more flexible in the orbits they can reach, these issues no longer dominate the equation, and I suspect if Hubble were launched today it would be put in a different orbit, probably 51.6o for easy servicing from ISS. The penalty for that orbit vs. 28.5o isn't that bad - it was just that the Shuttle was always riding the edge of its mass-to-orbit capacity and every m/s of delta-v counted dearly. At the time, the ISS didn't exist yet, so 28.5o was "the place to be" for optimal serviceability, as the Shuttle was the only game in town for that. That's no longer the case now that the Shuttle is retired and the ISS is now the focal point of LEO human spaceflight activity.

It's worth noting that when Hubble was under development, Space Station Freedom, before it became the ISS, was envisioned to be at 28.5o, since there was no need to reach it from Baikonur. Bringing Hubble to 51.6o would restore it to its originally envisioned accessibility.

Beyond that, I'm not really sure what would make a particular orbit more or less "desirable" for Hubble, but I'm pretty sure that changing its inclination to 51.6o, without changing any other orbital parameters, wouldn't change that.

The modern trend seems to be to send big space telescopes out to Earth-Sun L2 (e.g. JWST, Spektr-RG) so that they remain in a fixed position relative to the Sun and Earth, which apparently (my personal knowledge on this is fairly limited - this is per Wikipedia) can make "shielding and calibration...much simpler" because "an object around L2 will maintain the same relative position with respect to the Sun and Earth". But L2 is much more expensive to reach than LEO (JWST weighs ~6500 kg vs. Hubble's ~11000, and it's launching on a rocket better suited to high orbits than Shuttle, which had to rely on solid upper stages for that), so it wouldn't have been practical for something as big and heavy as Hubble (not to mention that it would have precluded Shuttle servicing flights). I get the impression that Hubble's current orbit was chosen as a practical compromise rather than for primarily scientific reasons.
Columbia was the heaviest of the orbital Orbiter Vehicles, all weights without SSME

OV-099 Challenger 155,400 pounds
OV-101 Enterprise 143,600 pounds (weight as used for Approach and Landing Tests)
OV-102 Columbia 158,289 pounds
OV-103 Discovery 151,419 pounds
OV-104 Atlantis 151,315 pounds
OV-105 Endeavour 151,205 pounds

Reaching ISS was never an issue, reaching ISS with an appreciable payload was.  SLWT, 5 segment boosters and 106% RPL on the SSME were looked at to claw back the losses to 51.6º.  SLWT alone accounted for over 1/2 of the payload clawback.  It was a big deal the day that NASA was informed that they would be working with Russia and that Freedom at 28.5º became ISS at 51.6º.

28.5º allowed for the highest orbital altitude with an apogee of approx 600 km.  The HST service missions were the "highest" STS missions.  Increasing inclination or orbital altitude BOTH reduce the max payload of the orbiter, or any launch vehicle. 28.5 vs 51.6º certainly is a major difference, no matter the launch/space vehicle.
Modern spacecraft have nowhere near the payload capacity that STS did. 28.5º to 51.6º most certainly IS a major payload hit.  Some modern launchers do and the fact that they have various launch facilities that allow pretty much any desired orbit.

OV-102 Columbia, the heaviest orbiter, was destined for ISS missions following her next OMDP(Orbiter Maintenance Down Period) which would have removed her internal airlock for STS-118 usage.



Paul

Offline gemmy0I

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #98 on: 07/28/2020 05:10 pm »
Columbia was the heaviest of the orbital Orbiter Vehicles, all weights without SSME

OV-099 Challenger 155,400 pounds
OV-101 Enterprise 143,600 pounds (weight as used for Approach and Landing Tests)
OV-102 Columbia 158,289 pounds
OV-103 Discovery 151,419 pounds
OV-104 Atlantis 151,315 pounds
OV-105 Endeavour 151,205 pounds

Reaching ISS was never an issue, reaching ISS with an appreciable payload was.  SLWT, 5 segment boosters and 106% RPL on the SSME were looked at to claw back the losses to 51.6º.  SLWT alone accounted for over 1/2 of the payload clawback.  It was a big deal the day that NASA was informed that they would be working with Russia and that Freedom at 28.5º became ISS at 51.6º.

28.5º allowed for the highest orbital altitude with an apogee of approx 600 km.  The HST service missions were the "highest" STS missions.  Increasing inclination or orbital altitude BOTH reduce the max payload of the orbiter, or any launch vehicle. 28.5 vs 51.6º certainly is a major difference, no matter the launch/space vehicle.
Modern spacecraft have nowhere near the payload capacity that STS did. 28.5º to 51.6º most certainly IS a major payload hit.  Some modern launchers do and the fact that they have various launch facilities that allow pretty much any desired orbit.

OV-102 Columbia, the heaviest orbiter, was destined for ISS missions following her next OMDP(Orbiter Maintenance Down Period) which would have removed her internal airlock for STS-118 usage.
Good to know, thanks for the detailed information! I stand corrected. :)

Offline TrevorMonty

Satellite servicing industry seeks interface standards

https://spacenews.com/satellite-servicing-industry-seeks-interface-standards/

NGSS are particularly interested in having this standard in place as their mission extension architecture can offer more services. A USB type interface that provides power and data means they could attach reaction module to replace faulty one, or extra payloads that would upgrade satellite helping to future proof if. In case of MEP (mission extension pod) satellite would have direct control of it, at present MEP is controlled from ground and doesn't communicate with satellite.

Refuelling ports is another on NGSS wish list, their preference is attaching external fuel tank instead of refuelling. Plus side is it contains pressurisation gas as well. Satellite just needs valves to switch between internal and external tank.

NGSS plan to upgrade the MEV to MRV(mission robot vehicle) ie MEV with robotic arms, this will stay on orbit indefinitely and be used to attach much simpler and cheaper MEP to satellite. MEP will supply MRV with fuel, pods and upgrades as part of their delivery mission. The MEP could then be attached to satellite. Unlike MEV which is attached satellite, MRV would be free most if time allowing it to be on call for satellites in trouble. This could be case of doing inspection, moving satellite to graveyard orbit or providing station keeping till MEP can be deployed. 
« Last Edit: 08/14/2020 08:31 pm by TrevorMonty »

Offline TrevorMonty

Found pricing for MEV, from article.

Anderson didn’t divulge how much it costs to build an MEV vehicle, but Intelsat previously said the company will pay Northrop Grumman $13 million a year to have MEV-1 attached to Intelsat 901 for five years.


https://www.theverge.com/2020/8/17/21366674/northrop-grumman-space-logistics-mev-2-satellite-servicing-life-extension

Offline baldusi

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #101 on: 08/18/2020 10:12 pm »
I think to remember that ARSAT-1/2 cost was about half bus half payload. MEV with simplified payload (just dock ops instruments and power transfer) might close the business case at surprisingly low numbers for GEO (like around that, 60M to 80M).

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In satellite operations, schedules are governed by the laws of physics and bounded by the limits of technology.

Offline TrevorMonty

Docked!

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/12/northrop-grumman-mev-2-spacecraft-services-intelsat-1002-.html
Another article on this.

https://www.intelsat.com/newsroom/northrop-grumman-and-intelsat-make-history-with-docking-of-second-mission-extension-vehicle-to-extend-life-of-satellite

This maybelast MEV, next up is MRV(mission robotic vehicle) and MEP(mission extension pod). MEP is lot cheaper and better option for extending satellite life, only provides thrust while satellite handles attitude control.

« Last Edit: 04/12/2021 07:48 pm by TrevorMonty »

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #105 on: 04/12/2021 09:15 pm »
Video news article:


Offline Star One

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MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #106 on: 04/15/2021 02:30 pm »
https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1381809630909755392

Quote
MEV-2 finally docked with IS10-02 in geostationary orbit at 1734 UTC Apr 12.  (The
@northropgrumman
 press release as 1.34pm EST, but they actually mean 1.34 pm EDT: https://news.northropgrumman.com/news/releases/northrop-grumman-and-intelsat-make-history-with-docking-of-second-mission-extension-vehicle-to-extend-life-of-satellite… )

https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1381810291881738241

Quote
(What is it with Americans not knowing how to write the time zone they are in? This is the 5th such mistake I've seen this month. Do they not teach you this in school? Daylight savings zones are PDT MDT CDT EDT, vs standard time zones PST MST CST EST)

https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1381810716680806400

Quote
(... and it *matters* particularly for the historical record - e.g. parts of the Mountain zone region - Arizona - are still on MST while other parts are on MDT. May not be obvious to someone years from now whether the writer was in such a locality. ...)

https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1381811519378317313

Quote
This rant brought to you by years of trying to convert missile and rocket launch times quoted in old newspaper articles and government documents  and trying to convert them to UTC...
« Last Edit: 04/15/2021 02:31 pm by Star One »

Offline Star One

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MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #107 on: 04/15/2021 02:33 pm »
https://twitter.com/planet4589/status/1381814065975193608

Quote
OK, so it was a genuine question because I grew up in the UK - apparently it sounds like you do in fact learn these things at some point, it's just that people here don't care enough to get it right even in a formal document.
« Last Edit: 04/15/2021 02:33 pm by Star One »

Offline Khadgars

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #108 on: 04/15/2021 02:39 pm »
Why are we posting a rant about time zones?
« Last Edit: 04/15/2021 02:40 pm by Khadgars »
Evil triumphs when good men do nothing - Thomas Jefferson

Offline Star One

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MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #109 on: 04/15/2021 04:56 pm »
Why are we posting a rant about time zones?
Read the first tweet and he explains in the tweets following why it’s important to get these things right. He was surprised as the error appeared in an official press release.
« Last Edit: 04/15/2021 05:46 pm by Star One »

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Offline XRZ.YZ

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #111 on: 02/21/2022 06:13 pm »
https://spacenews.com/northrop-grumman-to-launch-new-satellite-servicing-mission-in-2024/

Quote
WASHINGTON — SpaceLogistics, a satellite-servicing firm owned by Northrop Grumman, announced Feb. 21 it plans to send to orbit a new servicing vehicle in 2024 on a SpaceX rocket.

This will be the debut of the company’s Mission Robotic Vehicle, a servicing spacecraft equipped with a robotic arm that will install propulsion jet packs on dying satellites. The first customer for the MRV is Optus, Australia’s largest satellite operator.

SpaceLogistics vice president Joseph Anderson told SpaceNews that the MRV was built with many of the same technologies used in the company’s Mission Extension Vehicles. Two MEVs are in orbit currently providing station-keeping services for two Intelsat geostationary satellites that were running low on fuel.

The MRV’s robotic arm was developed by the U.S. Naval Research Laboratory with funding from the Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency. DARPA in 2020 signed an agreement with Northrop Grumman allowing the company to use the robotic payload on the MRV in exchange for access to technology demonstrations and program data.

The MRV and three propulsion jet packs — known as Mission Extension Pods — are now being assembled at Northrop Grumman’s facility in Dulles, Virginia. Anderson said all three pods will launch in 2024 with the MRV — one will be installed on an Optus satellite and the other two are for other customers that have not yet been announced.

The MEPs are propulsion devices designed to extend the service life of a 2,000 kilogram satellite by six years.

The mission in 2024 will launch the MRV — a 3,000 kilogram spacecraft — and three MEPs, each about 400 kilograms. The MRV and MEPs will be released from the launch vehicle, independently deploy and raise themselves to a geostationary orbit using solar electric propulsion.

Once in orbit each MEP is captured by the MRV and stowed for transport to the client satellite. The MRV rendezvous and docks with the client to install the MEP, which operates like an auxiliary propulsion device and uses its own thrusters to maneuver the client vehicle. Then the MRV detaches itself and moves on to grab another MEP for the next customer. The MRV is designed to stay in orbit for 10 years.

Anderson said the company expects to install as many as 30 propulsion pods over the life of the MRV.

“Our manifest for the MRV is full through mid 2026,” he said. Besides Optus, five other customers have signed term sheets to purchase mission extension pods.

The company is not disclosing the price of its MRV services. It’s a different service than the MEV, Anderson explained. The MEP is sold as a product. “Part of that purchase price includes the installation in orbit, and we use our mission robotic vehicle to do that installation.” SpaceLogistics owns the robotic vehicle but the mission extension pod is owned and operated by the client.

The MRV uses the same sensor technologies, the same rendezvous and proximity operations concepts developed for the MEV, said Anderson. “We removed the docking mechanism and replaced it with the robotic payload from DARPA,” he added. “And the way we attach the MEP to the client vehicle with a docking mechanism, that also has direct heritage and from the mission extension vehicle.”

The MEV and MRV will service satellites in geosynchronous orbit. SpaceLogistics has no plans currently to provide services in low Earth orbit, although it might consider opportunities in debris removal.

“Certainly there’s a significant debris issue in low Earth orbit that one day will need to be addressed,” said Anderson. “Everything we’re doing today for satellite servicing in GEO can be directly applied to debris mitigation in low Earth orbit or to other services there, if and when customers decide to pay for those types of services.”
XQCR LLYZ GYZH HZSZ

Online gongora

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Re: MEV (Mission Extension Vehicle) : In space GEOsat servicing
« Reply #112 on: 11/08/2022 04:36 pm »
1274-EX-CN-2022

Quote
Intelsat proposes to raise Galaxy 25 from its station-keeping box in geostationary orbit to 300- 330 km above the geostationary arc and drift for two years before docking with the MEV.

Galaxy 25 will drift approximately 4 degrees per day and be placed into sun acquisition mode. During this time, Intelsat will continue radiofrequency interference mitigation, close approach monitoring, and TT&C operations. Intelsat will also coordinate with other satellite operators throughout the drift. The estimated end of Galaxy 25’s maneuverable life for this drift as proposed is 2025.

After approximately two years of drifting, Galaxy 25 will dock with the MEV, and the MEV will perform a series of tests while docked. Intelsat will continue to coordinate operations with other satellite operators throughout the docking phase.

Following this proof of concept, Galaxy 25 will be fully decommissioned consistent with the Orbital Debris Mitigation Plan submitted by Intelsat and previously approved by the Commission in connection with Galaxy 25’s commercial authorization.

Intelsat agrees toaccept the same orbital debris obligations that currently apply to the Galaxy 25 spacecraft as a condition of the requested experimental license. To the extent there is any delay with the proposed docking with the MEV, Intelsat will decommission the satellite prior to docking as needed to comply with the previously approved Orbital Debris Mitigation Plan.

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https://twitter.com/jeff_foust/status/1636373579326722048
Quote
Robert Hauge of SpaceLogistics says on a #satshow panel this morning the company has taken deposits on the 2nd and 3rd Mission Extension Pods (1st sold to Optus) and is in negotiations on the 4th.

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https://www.cnbc.com/2023/04/13/investing-in-space-intelsat-signs-up-for-northrop-grumman-satellite-servicing.html
Quote
Northrop Grumman’s latest version of this tech represents a more flexible approach: A larger model, called MRV (or mission robotic vehicle), will carry three MEPs (or mission extension pods), that it plans to deliver and connect with three satellites in 2026.
...
Intelsat ordered one of the MEPs, as did Australian satellite operator Optus. A third is expected to be sold soon.

Looks like it may have slipped a bit

Offline Yiosie

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https://www.cnbc.com/2023/04/13/investing-in-space-intelsat-signs-up-for-northrop-grumman-satellite-servicing.html
Quote
Northrop Grumman’s latest version of this tech represents a more flexible approach: A larger model, called MRV (or mission robotic vehicle), will carry three MEPs (or mission extension pods), that it plans to deliver and connect with three satellites in 2026.
...
Intelsat ordered one of the MEPs, as did Australian satellite operator Optus. A third is expected to be sold soon.

Looks like it may have slipped a bit

To clarify, the MRV is launching in late 2024 to install the MEP for Optus in 2025, and the MEP for Intelsat in 2026:

SpaceLogistics to service Intelsat satellite after Optus life-extending mission [dated Apr. 14]

Quote from: SpaceNews
Intelsat has ordered one of three fuel pods Northrop Grumman’s in-orbit servicing subsidiary is launching in late 2024 to extend the life of one of its geostationary satellites by at least six years, the operator announced April 13.

The company is still deciding which of the more than 50 satellites in its fleet will be equipped with a Mission Extension Pod (MEP) from SpaceLogistics, which plans to install it in 2026 using a Mission Robotic Vehicle (MRV) servicer with a robotic arm.

<snip>

One of the three pods is intended for Australian satellite operator Optus, announced last year as SpaceLogistics’ first customer for the Mission Extension Pod service. If all goes to plan, the Mission Robotic Vehicle will install a pod on Optus D3 satellite in 2025.

SpaceLogistics has not announced a customer for the third fuel pod, but the company’s president, Rob Hauge, said it is as good as sold. “We are finalizing negotiations for a third MEP, “which will complete the first launch manifest,” Hauge said.

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