Author Topic: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)  (Read 346184 times)

Offline Orbital Debris

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #620 on: 05/02/2012 03:37 am »
{snip}
Could SpaceX take on Bigelow as a customer?

They already have.  Bigelow was one of SpaceX's first customers.  Although the flight is on permanent slip.

Bigelow was on the manifest to put a Galaxy on a Falcon 5.  The current manifest has Bigelow on a Falcon 9 in 2015.  However, I don't know what they would put on it, the Falcon 9 does not have the payload to put a BA330 into LEO.

Offline Danderman

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #621 on: 05/02/2012 03:43 am »
Bigelow has said he's buying an Atlas V to launch in 2014.

If anybody has actual confirmation this is not the plan any more I'd like to see it.

http://www.spacex.com/launch_manifest.php

Bigelow Aerospace   2015  Falcon 9 Cape Canaveral

This alleged launch is falling behind about a year for every six months of real life.

Offline Robotbeat

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #622 on: 05/02/2012 03:44 am »
Bigelow has said he's buying an Atlas V to launch in 2014.

If anybody has actual confirmation this is not the plan any more I'd like to see it.

http://www.spacex.com/launch_manifest.php

Bigelow Aerospace   2015  Falcon 9 Cape Canaveral

This alleged launch is falling behind about a year for every six months of real life.

The Atlas V flight may refer to a CST-100 test flight. In fact, I bet that's what it is.
Chris  Whoever loves correction loves knowledge, but he who hates reproof is stupid.

To the maximum extent practicable, the Federal Government shall plan missions to accommodate the space transportation services capabilities of United States commercial providers. US law http://goo.gl/YZYNt0

Offline Lurker Steve

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #623 on: 05/02/2012 03:59 pm »
Bigelow has said he's buying an Atlas V to launch in 2014.

If anybody has actual confirmation this is not the plan any more I'd like to see it.

http://www.spacex.com/launch_manifest.php

Bigelow Aerospace   2015  Falcon 9 Cape Canaveral

This alleged launch is falling behind about a year for every six months of real life.

The Atlas V flight may refer to a CST-100 test flight. In fact, I bet that's what it is.

We know that Bigelow has built the CST-100 test articles, but Boeing is going to build CST-100 capsules in OPF-3, right ? Wouldn't the first CST-100 capsule for launch, even for a test flight, come out of OPF-3 ?

Offline Robotbeat

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #624 on: 05/02/2012 04:04 pm »
Bigelow has said he's buying an Atlas V to launch in 2014.

If anybody has actual confirmation this is not the plan any more I'd like to see it.

http://www.spacex.com/launch_manifest.php

Bigelow Aerospace   2015  Falcon 9 Cape Canaveral

This alleged launch is falling behind about a year for every six months of real life.

The Atlas V flight may refer to a CST-100 test flight. In fact, I bet that's what it is.

We know that Bigelow has built the CST-100 test articles, but Boeing is going to build CST-100 capsules in OPF-3, right ? Wouldn't the first CST-100 capsule for launch, even for a test flight, come out of OPF-3 ?

Very possibly. I haven't actually heard the exact details of what Robert Bigelow said, but Bigelow Aerospace is helping some with CST-100, and CST-100 will need a test launch in around the 2014 time frame and will use the Atlas V launch vehicle, so everything fits with that interpretation.

It certainly doesn't seem to fit with the idea that Bigelow will launch a space station in 2014. Though I suppose something like BEAM isn't impossible in that timeframe (but that hasn't been approved yet, so it's probably several years too early there).

Remember, an Atlas V launch is pretty expensive, $100-150 million, so Bigelow wouldn't launch on it just for the heck of it, he'd have to be paid for it.
Chris  Whoever loves correction loves knowledge, but he who hates reproof is stupid.

To the maximum extent practicable, the Federal Government shall plan missions to accommodate the space transportation services capabilities of United States commercial providers. US law http://goo.gl/YZYNt0

Offline Danderman

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #625 on: 05/02/2012 04:06 pm »

We know that Bigelow has built the CST-100 test articles

Really?

Offline Robotbeat

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #626 on: 05/02/2012 04:07 pm »

We know that Bigelow has built the CST-100 test articles

Really?

They built the one that just was air-dropped.
Chris  Whoever loves correction loves knowledge, but he who hates reproof is stupid.

To the maximum extent practicable, the Federal Government shall plan missions to accommodate the space transportation services capabilities of United States commercial providers. US law http://goo.gl/YZYNt0

Offline Garrett

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #627 on: 05/02/2012 05:17 pm »

We know that Bigelow has built the CST-100 test articles

Really?

They built the one that just was air-dropped.
was surprised to hear that too, but some Internet searching appears to confirm it (though I probably shouldn't be doubting you Robotbeat ;) )

So why does a big aeronautical and aerospace company such as Boeing need to outsource such a prestigious project? Do they think it's not important enough to build up internal experience or is it because they simply don't think of aerospace engineering as a core activity?
- "Nothing shocks me. I'm a scientist." - Indiana Jones

Offline Lurker Steve

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #628 on: 05/02/2012 05:41 pm »

We know that Bigelow has built the CST-100 test articles

Really?

They built the one that just was air-dropped.
was surprised to hear that too, but some Internet searching appears to confirm it (though I probably shouldn't be doubting you Robotbeat ;) )

So why does a big aeronautical and aerospace company such as Boeing need to outsource such a prestigious project? Do they think it's not important enough to build up internal experience or is it because they simply don't think of aerospace engineering as a core activity?

Maybe Bigelow can build the test articles cheaper than Boeing can internally ? OD mentioned that they built 3 of them. (check the CST-100 thread)

Offline yg1968

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #629 on: 05/02/2012 05:47 pm »
Bigelow has said he's buying an Atlas V to launch in 2014.

If anybody has actual confirmation this is not the plan any more I'd like to see it.

http://www.spacex.com/launch_manifest.php

Bigelow Aerospace   2015  Falcon 9 Cape Canaveral

This alleged launch is falling behind about a year for every six months of real life.


Bigelow was asked about this flight in an interview a few months ago. He said that instead of reimbursing Bigelow for its deposit on a Falcon 5 flight, SpaceX decided to reserve them a Falcon 9 flight. But he made it sound like that flight was only a placeholder.
« Last Edit: 05/02/2012 05:48 pm by yg1968 »

Offline baldusi

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #630 on: 05/02/2012 06:28 pm »
Bigelow has said he's buying an Atlas V to launch in 2014.

If anybody has actual confirmation this is not the plan any more I'd like to see it.

http://www.spacex.com/launch_manifest.php

Bigelow Aerospace   2015  Falcon 9 Cape Canaveral

This alleged launch is falling behind about a year for every six months of real life.


Bigelow was asked about this flight in an interview a few months ago. He said that instead of reimbursing Bigelow for its deposit on a Falcon 5 flight, SpaceX decided to reserve them a Falcon 9 flight. But he made it sound like that flight was only a placeholder.
He stated something more like he did a 50k deposit (or was it 20k?) for a Falcon 5 flight. But then that vehicle never materialized. So SpaceX asked him if they could keep his money and keep him on the manifest, and he said yes. The way he tells it it sound just shy of a gift. I'm sure that he being the business man he is, it might come with some string attached, like a significant discount from list price when and if he decides to use it. But that's just speculation. It's just that no business man of that magnitude gifts that money. They might spend ten times more on a birthday gift, but business is business.

Offline yg1968

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #631 on: 05/02/2012 06:34 pm »
Bigelow has said he's buying an Atlas V to launch in 2014.

If anybody has actual confirmation this is not the plan any more I'd like to see it.

http://www.spacex.com/launch_manifest.php

Bigelow Aerospace   2015  Falcon 9 Cape Canaveral

This alleged launch is falling behind about a year for every six months of real life.


Bigelow was asked about this flight in an interview a few months ago. He said that instead of reimbursing Bigelow for its deposit on a Falcon 5 flight, SpaceX decided to reserve them a Falcon 9 flight. But he made it sound like that flight was only a placeholder.
He stated something more like he did a 50k deposit (or was it 20k?) for a Falcon 5 flight. But then that vehicle never materialized. So SpaceX asked him if they could keep his money and keep him on the manifest, and he said yes. The way he tells it it sound just shy of a gift. I'm sure that he being the business man he is, it might come with some string attached, like a significant discount from list price when and if he decides to use it. But that's just speculation. It's just that no business man of that magnitude gifts that money. They might spend ten times more on a birthday gift, but business is business.

I thought the amounts were more in the millions (not in the thousands). I suspect that there may have been some legal issues involved. Contrary to popular belief, a deposit is not generally reimbursable. So SpaceX may not have been willing to reimburse Bigelow.

Offline Garrett

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #632 on: 05/02/2012 06:40 pm »
Maybe Bigelow can build the test articles cheaper than Boeing can internally ?

I hope that's not the reason as it would mean bad news for any internal engineering/manufacturing teams. The only good reason I can see for outsourcing is when it's not part of your core activity. Maybe the top brass at Boeing only want to commit project management resources and a small engineering team for the time being until they're sure that CST-100 will actually go ahead?

This is becoming more of a CST-100 discussion, so I might just copy this over to the appropriate thread.

Update: discussion brought over to the CST-100 thread.
« Last Edit: 05/02/2012 06:48 pm by Garrett »
- "Nothing shocks me. I'm a scientist." - Indiana Jones

Offline rcoppola

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #633 on: 05/10/2012 09:05 pm »
I suppose this could go in a SpaceX thread as well.

Very exciting development:

http://www.spacex.com/press.php?page=20120510
 
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Offline A_M_Swallow

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #634 on: 05/10/2012 09:10 pm »
Something that just struck me.  The BA 330 has a crew of 6.  The Dragon takes 7 passengers.  Where does the pilot sleep?

Offline Jason1701

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #635 on: 05/10/2012 09:13 pm »
Empty seat.

Offline Jorge

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #636 on: 05/10/2012 09:18 pm »
Empty seat.

Right, space for cargo.
JRF

Offline oldAtlas_Eguy

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #637 on: 05/10/2012 09:59 pm »
Think about this: 3 BA330’s linked together with a crew capacity of 18 and 100% crew swap out every 6 months, that’s a minimum of 6 crew flights per year. Plus you would need 3 docking ports for the 3 CEV/crew vehicles and two or more ports for cargo vessels that would be about, at one cargo vessel per person per year, 18 visiting cargo vessels per year or 1 every 3 weeks. And you though the VV logistics of ISS was difficult.

Although with a good regenerative ECLSS and some capacity to grow some food, the cargo deliveries could be nearly half that of ISS or 1 cargo flight per every 2 persons per year for 9 or 10cargo flights per year.

Offline Proponent

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #638 on: 05/11/2012 04:09 am »
I'd have thought a rationale for seven seats would be to allow for the possibility of rotating crews of six with a taxi business model rather than a rental-car model.  In other words, following arrival at the station with the new crew, the pilot immediately returns to Earth with the old one.

Offline docmordrid

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Re: Bigelow Aerospace Update Thread (2)
« Reply #639 on: 05/11/2012 11:34 am »
Found this new image in a lucky search.
DM

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