Author Topic: Star Trek Discovery  (Read 35058 times)

Offline MATTBLAK

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #200 on: 10/18/2017 10:38 PM »
In the era this show is set; they should be D-5's, which look similar but have a shorter, fatter neck! How do I know? Watch 'Prelude To Axanar...' ;)
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Offline nacnud

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #201 on: 10/18/2017 11:56 PM »
I wish that they'd made the full feature of that instead of this.
« Last Edit: 10/18/2017 11:56 PM by nacnud »

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #202 on: 10/20/2017 09:48 PM »
* I loved TNG but it gets really annoying that virtually no episode affects any other episode.

So here is a really good article that goes into that. I think the author makes some great points:

https://io9.gizmodo.com/serialized-television-has-become-a-disease-1819660859

"At New York Comic Con, X-Files creator/showrunner Chris Carter told press that this change in perception of how TV stories have to be told has changed the writing of the rebooted X-Files a bit. “It’s known as a show that has a mythology and standalone episodes, and so the audience has always gone with us from one thing to another,” he said. “I would say we’re even working harder to make those transitions seamless where we never worked quite as hard when the series was originally on. We would just do a hardcore mythology episode and go right into a comedy episode. And the audience always went with us. I think we’re more careful about that now.”

Save for sitcoms, it seems like there’s a definite polarization happening in terms of serialization versus episodic television. Along with with seasons of television that are binged, analyzed, and dissected endlessly for clues about where they’re going, there’s also been a rise in anthologies, miniseries, and made-for-TV movies. Both Game of Thrones and Black Mirror have critical, commercial, and zeitgeist-y success with radically different approaches to television. The middle ground, however, has vanished.

It’s harder now for a show to have a few perfect episodes—episodes that, on their own, justify the existence of the whole show. Everything is so intertwined that you can’t tease out a single episode that’s fun to watch on its own merits. There are people who still feel the end of Lost poisoned the rest of the show. Maybe if the mythology hadn’t taken over, that could have been prevented. That, more than the stuff about hope or violence or even cursing, is what I’m looking for when I watch Star Trek: Discovery—that perfect episode that was more a morality play performed by characters I loved than the puzzle piece of a grand design.

The way Discovery is shaking out—the way all television works now—I have trouble seeing where a standalone episode isn’t an aberration rather than part of the fabric. Which makes that show getting its own “City on the Edge of Forever,” or “The Inner Light,” or “Far Beyond the Stars,” or “The Thaw,” or “In a Mirror, Darkly,” to name one for each other Star Trek show. We’re never going to see a crew of people we know stop by a planet with a portal to the past, use it, and then move on to the next thing. That’s not “realistic.” Even if it did reveal a truth."

Offline dodo

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #203 on: 10/21/2017 07:57 AM »

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #204 on: 10/21/2017 12:51 PM »
Let the lawsuits begin!

Offline nacnud

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #205 on: 10/21/2017 01:05 PM »
Oh wow, that is far too close to be coincidental!
« Last Edit: 10/21/2017 01:06 PM by nacnud »

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #206 on: 10/23/2017 02:00 PM »
Saw episode 1:6
Oh Admiral... Oh my...!! :o
« Last Edit: 10/23/2017 03:42 PM by Rocket Science »
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Offline Star One

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Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #207 on: 10/25/2017 06:49 AM »
To have a somewhat reprehensible character as Captain does make him one of the more interesting characters on the show. The guy playing Sarek makes him an always watchable character as well. What’s a bit worrying is the character who is supposed to be her focus on the show is now proving to be one of the least interesting, after a strong start.

Thought this week’s episode was better than the last one, the fact that the new security chief is so obviously a Klingon that you wonder if it’s a double bluff.

It seems that like Who a rest from TV has done the Trek franchise some good.

Glad it got renewed for a second season after all the online doom & gloom before it even started.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/star-trek-discovery-renewed-season-2-cbs-all-access-1051003
« Last Edit: 10/25/2017 06:50 AM by Star One »

Offline QuantumG

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #208 on: 10/25/2017 08:07 AM »
Soooo... is just me or is swearing in Star Trek the final straw for any one else? They trying to generate power from Gene Roddenberry's spinning corpse or what?


Jeff Bezos has billions to spend on rockets and can go at whatever pace he likes! Wow! What pace is he going at? Well... have you heard of Zeno's paradox?

Offline jarnu

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #209 on: 10/25/2017 09:44 AM »
Soooo... is just me or is swearing in Star Trek the final straw for any one else? They trying to generate power from Gene Roddenberry's spinning corpse or what?

It is really difficult for me to evaluate many things in current American culture. One of those items is swearing. There is not such an issue with any 'adult' TV show in Europe, as far as I know, related to how people interact, communicate, act under stress, talk to each other in bed, in the shower, to the partner of the same sex, to the partner of different culture or skin shade colour, to the bosses, to a priest, church, god or goddess, to children, to other people children, to authorities, about military, about chain of command, about harassment of any kind, about politics, and any topic you think if fits the maturity of the audience, people in the same room, age of the speaker or character or personality trait.

So you don't have too much room for a stupid plot, simple development, black and white morals (as in good/bad, sin/virtue), but for fair judgement, convenience actions, resilience, acceptance, patience, intelligence as wisdom and as deep logic... If Star Trek needs to feed the audience with wonders of the kind of teenager level of adult rule challenge ('swearing'), paternalism, simple warmongering (a job needs to be done, simple morals), military recruiting level of dialogue and discourse (I will be a captain, you need to do exercise and to eat healthy food, take your cereals for breakfast, be a good girl), abusive levels of testosterone (many girls in this show are violent, irreflexive, and cause havoc and dead, like the main character, like the security officer, they are typical males covered as females) targeted to a new audience, the coward, the passive, the intelligent (Saru), showing indoctrination plot levels about correct actions in a war situation (bombs in an enemy dead corpse), ... I can go on and on. If the show needs to do all of those things to survive or to thrive in the current America, fine. I'm not the public.

I had fears about a stupid plot filled with a slow burn mystery, that, obviously, is related to the main character(s). This is Lost, Fringe, and other really silly and time waste TV of late. But, in a sense, being Star Trek, is worse. Game of Thrones levels of money and special effects, sure. Without upsetting too much the ultraconservative society who should pay to watch it.

Try River from BBC, to see how an adult express love, grief and wonder. Try 'Department Q', specifically the third TV-film, to see how to put current (almost-)real people working together with cultural issues and differences. Just watch any French or Nordic or British show, where homosexuality is not a thing, like drinking water or doing a poo is not a thing.

Yes, there are racial issues here, some cultural, many related to income and poverty of affected victims. Religion is not a big thing, as it is not (depend on the country) police or military. Female equality is a problem. That one, yes. Working on it, hard.

This is not Star Trek pushing any boundaries at all, at all. It is another TV Show filled with violence, false pretence of adult people interacting, false dialogue and moral constraints in war related scenarios. It is as adult as any Marvel/DC Comic Book movie. And as interesting as such movies as well. It is a distorted reality field where 'real' consequences of actions and supposed war stressed staff don't match 'real' level of fear, of damage, of hope, of intelligence or of any other 'real' behaviour any intelligent writer should put in front of you if they want coherence. It is manipulation of adulthood to match teenager fantasies about it. And that trend is very American (as USA-made content).

Edit: a word.
« Last Edit: 10/25/2017 09:58 AM by jarnu »

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #210 on: 10/25/2017 12:57 PM »

It is really difficult for me to evaluate many things in current American culture.

You know, if you don't like American culture and television, you don't have to watch. I'm sure that you can change the channel and find Benny Hill or The Vicar of Dibley to enjoy.

Online spacenut

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #211 on: 10/25/2017 01:14 PM »
I worked for 40 years with a company and only one person used swear words and he was demoted.  What I consider bad language just wasn't used.  It was mostly field work even with pipeline construction, guys in the field talked mostly about sports, and sometimes politics.  Hollywood thinks the real world uses bad language all the time and they really don't, not in flyover America.  I hear more bad stuff on TV and the movies than I care for.  Also what people do and how they act, should be private, and not pushed on anyone.  I am continuing to watch this show, but it is not the way people really act and do around each other in the real world.  I can understand different alien cultures, but not humans.  The different alien cultures is what gave the old Star Trek episodes spice.  They were like one human emotion, or lack of amplified.  Humans were the ones striking a balance.   

Offline Thorny

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #212 on: 10/25/2017 01:20 PM »
Soooo... is just me or is swearing in Star Trek the final straw for any one else? They trying to generate power from Gene Roddenberry's spinning corpse or what?

I think Roddenberry would have done so if he'd been allowed to. He was all about pushing envelopes, especially in the '60s and '70s, and was constantly at odds with NBC during the Original Series. He had no problem with 'colorful metaphors' in Star Trek IV.

Offline Cherokee43v6

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #213 on: 10/25/2017 01:35 PM »
Soooo... is just me or is swearing in Star Trek the final straw for any one else? They trying to generate power from Gene Roddenberry's spinning corpse or what?

I think Roddenberry would have done so if he'd been allowed to. He was all about pushing envelopes, especially in the '60s and '70s, and was constantly at odds with NBC during the Original Series. He had no problem with 'colorful metaphors' in Star Trek IV.

Ah, but the beauty of the 'colorful metaphors' in Star Trek IV is that they're being delivered by someone with only a partial 'historical' grasp of their usage.  Clearly, if the language referenced as occurring in the show is commonplace, then Kirk would not have been so 'fish out of water funny' in his usage in ST:IV
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Offline Star One

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #214 on: 10/25/2017 01:54 PM »
Soooo... is just me or is swearing in Star Trek the final straw for any one else? They trying to generate power from Gene Roddenberry's spinning corpse or what?

Jebbers you’re making an issue over a trivial matter like that.

Offline Oberon_Command

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #215 on: 10/25/2017 02:42 PM »
Speaking as a left-leaning millennial (I'm in my mid '20s) Canadian from the west coast, the "colourful metaphors" in Star Trek as a whole actually seem unrealistically tame to me. Adding more swearing actually makes the language more believable to me, especially if the characters are young.

I suspect this may well be partly a generational thing. My baby boomer parents still think of "the 7 words you cannot say on television" as powerful curses that you don't say unless you're profoundly angry and you definitely don't say them at work. My friends and coworkers use them among ourselves (though not in polite company who we think might take offense) on a daily basis. Of course, I work at a video game studio as a programmer - not exactly a suit-and-tie shop, so that may skew my experience somewhat - but when I meet someone outside of work, who is both close to my age and doesn't use profanity the way the rest of my cohort seems to, my assumption is that they're quite prudish and probably came from a very sheltered, devoutly religious, or very socially-conservative background. Neither of those are particularly common where I live, so they stand out. :P

This isn't to say that there aren't some boundaries, of course. Saying that the database is f*cked is fine, but using "gay" and "retarded" as pejoratives can earn you some very dirty looks.  As it turns out, language is not a static thing. What is considered truly "profane" tends to change from generation to generation. F*ck and sh*t simply do not carry the same weight for my generation the way it did for the ones that preceded us.
« Last Edit: 10/25/2017 02:47 PM by Oberon_Command »

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #216 on: 10/25/2017 03:15 PM »
When I brought up my comment about another "first" by Star Trek with-out spoiling a couple of weeks ago it was about the use of the "F-Bomb". Now that we all seem to be discussing it, I'll give my 2cents.... While in the film Star Trek IV, the "mild-cussing" was both instructive to the crew in terms of colloquialism and that they had evolved past such vulgarity in "their" present time, not so much in the 80's. It also provided comical relief when spoken by Spock at his science station on the bridge. ;D The use of it on the current TV series just seemed "gratuitous" to me and served no real purpose which caused me to raise my brow Spock-like... ??? Unless, it's now "a vulgar Star Trek for the vulgar times we live in:.. IMHO
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Offline Blackstar

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #217 on: 10/25/2017 03:18 PM »
So, I think we can all agree: this show would be much better if they used words like "frak" and "feldergarb."



http://www.syfy.com/syfywire/shazbot_check_out_14_frak

« Last Edit: 11/26/2017 03:39 PM by Blackstar »

Online the_other_Doug

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #218 on: 10/25/2017 05:44 PM »
Just as a note to Asif and others -- your experience of how "normal human beings" act and mine, and the next person's, are likely different.  People act (and speak) differently based, a lot, on how they were raised, and (I hate to say it) on the socio-economic class to which they belong.

I work in customer service, and speak to hundreds of people a week from all over the U.S.  There is most definitely a large percentage of people who live in "flyover America" who believe that it is quite reasonable to pepper their language liberally with F-bombs and to use the vulgar term of feces in *literally* every sentence.  I do not exaggerate.

Just because you tend to interact with a more professional group of people (as some -- but not all -- engineers do) doesn't mean that everyone who comes from the same part of the world as they do acts as politely as they do.  It all comes down to how you were raised.

Also, I will repeat an observation that I made an awful long time ago:  Americans began to show a marked adjustment to the level of acceptable profanity in everyday speech after the G.I. Joes came back from WWII and began to use the barracks-language they learned during the wartime experiences in "polite" company.  Their parents' generation never accepted this, but their children's generation (i.e., people my age) found such words as acceptable.  A lot of us (and follow-on generations) just don't think in terms of F-bombs and other such profanity as offensive; due to the language we heard while growing up, such words were never used to cause offense, and as such, our language centers were not wired to immediately respond by taking offense when we hear them.

As such, this new Star Trek is trying, I think, to reinforce the concept that peoples' behaviors become much less polite when faced with the ridiculousness and basic illogic of wartime stresses.  It paints a view of the otherwise polite 23rd-century Terran civilization as being ultimately human -- i.e., if those mild-mannered people can be driven to profanity, this should communicate the levels of stress fighting a war can generate.

Your mileage may vary.
-Doug  (With my shield, not yet upon it)

Offline Blackstar

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Re: Star Trek Discovery
« Reply #219 on: 10/25/2017 05:52 PM »
Spotted in the most recent episode:

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