Nice article Chris! I’m looking forward to see the first images of DC in flight to replace the "fancy" artwork we’ve had to tide us over...
Quote from: Rocket Science on 05/12/2013 06:54 pmNice article Chris! I’m looking forward to see the first images of DC in flight to replace the "fancy" artwork we’ve had to tide us over...Thanks. Although they've had some very nice artwork for this vehicle already.
I like the name. I assume the other names are in L2, but can anyone say if they are good names too?
Question :1) Is the Engineering Test Article (ETA), the same airframe mockup that was carried by Helicopter in Colorado ?? 2) Then the Flight Test Article (FTA) is the airframe that is being built by Lockheed ? 3) I was wondering whether they had built enough controls for the aero surfaces into the ETA, and that could have been the cause for the delays. They probably need the FTA airframe in order to successfully complete the free flight / drop tests. Sure, they could probably use the existing ETA for the drop tests, but it might not do much more than emulate a falling rock.
Quote from: Lurker Steve on 05/13/2013 02:34 pmQuestion :1) Is the Engineering Test Article (ETA), the same airframe mockup that was carried by Helicopter in Colorado ?? 2) Then the Flight Test Article (FTA) is the airframe that is being built by Lockheed ? 3) I was wondering whether they had built enough controls for the aero surfaces into the ETA, and that could have been the cause for the delays. They probably need the FTA airframe in order to successfully complete the free flight / drop tests. Sure, they could probably use the existing ETA for the drop tests, but it might not do much more than emulate a falling rock.In the style of Jim:1) Yes.2) Yes.3) You're making assumptions based on what? I wrote about what caused the delay. No idea where you're going with the rest of that.
Maybe I'm just looking for some action in the DC thread, since it doesn't seem that the SNC engineering teams are not generating much news.
Does anyone get much excitement from these NASA review milestones, other than maybe the accountants ?
where does it say that the drop tests are piloted?
Quote from: Jim on 05/13/2013 05:35 pmwhere does it say that the drop tests are piloted?Well, here's 2:
I'm excited! Dreamchaser is a beautiful vehicle. Testing is a brilliant example of applied engineering coupled with a very brave test pilot:"The drop will be via a helicopter, and carried out early in the morning, in near darkness, before the Californian weather becomes too warm to fly the helicopter at the altitudes required for the testing."I wish that pilot steady hands, owl-eyes, and a support staff that doesn't screw up. IMHO, he's a hero.
And a picture of her all wrapped up like Atlantis was:
Quote from: Chris Bergin on 05/13/2013 07:30 pmAnd a picture of her all wrapped up like Atlantis was:From that picture, maybe she should be christened "Narwhal"! What is that spike out front?
Quote from: IanO on 05/13/2013 08:12 pmQuote from: Chris Bergin on 05/13/2013 07:30 pmAnd a picture of her all wrapped up like Atlantis was:From that picture, maybe she should be christened "Narwhal"! What is that spike out front?It's for data. Just like it was on Enterprise.
pitch-yaw air data test boom…
Quote from: Rocket Science on 05/13/2013 09:00 pmpitch-yaw air data test boom… Oh, it's got to include dynamic and static pressure too, wouldn't you think? 5-hole probe + static ring?
https://twitter.com/NASADryden/status/337253204301590528/photo/1https://twitter.com/NASADryden/status/337247592587071489/photo/1https://twitter.com/NASADryden/status/337247592587071489/photo/1
See Quote from: yg1968 on 05/22/2013 06:12 pmhttps://twitter.com/NASADryden/status/337253204301590528/photo/1https://twitter.com/NASADryden/status/337247592587071489/photo/1https://twitter.com/NASADryden/status/337247592587071489/photo/1In these pictures taken at Dryden, there is a visible "bulge" showing just forward and above the flag. Is that one of the drop test attachment points, or is that a protruberance that will be there on the flight vehicle too?
In reading the Aviation Week article (which nicely ties the DC ALT program into lifting-body history), it mentions that several ground tests will occur before the first ALT free flight.One of these is noted as a test of the parachute deployment system. I don't recall hearing about this previously. Can someone clarify this for me?
Short article on the upcoming DC tests in the Aviation Week web site.
Quote from: BrightLight on 06/04/2013 04:29 pmShort article on the upcoming DC tests in the Aviation Week web site.She's got a "great stance" sitting on her gear...
I didn't notice a nose landing strut door, it looks bare, unlike the rear wheels.
Finally a clear image of the ETA stern. (Thanks to Rocket Science)
Quote from: BrightLight on 06/05/2013 03:50 pmFinally a clear image of the ETA stern. (Thanks to Rocket Science)Your welcome... and I made sure I sealed the hatch after I climbed inside. The “fuzzy dice” are fun to squeeze... JK
Quote from: Rocket Science on 06/05/2013 04:07 pmQuote from: BrightLight on 06/05/2013 03:50 pmFinally a clear image of the ETA stern. (Thanks to Rocket Science)Your welcome... and I made sure I sealed the hatch after I climbed inside. The “fuzzy dice” are fun to squeeze... JK Any pictures from inside available for sharing ?
Wow, didn't realized that project was so advanced in its schedule. Looking at the photo I felt "this is no longer powerpoint or CGI. This is real."
Quote from: Archibald on 07/10/2013 08:00 amWow, didn't realized that project was so advanced in its schedule. Looking at the photo I felt "this is no longer powerpoint or CGI. This is real." Technically it's pretty far behind schedule.
Quote from: manboy on 07/10/2013 08:45 amQuote from: Archibald on 07/10/2013 08:00 amWow, didn't realized that project was so advanced in its schedule. Looking at the photo I felt "this is no longer powerpoint or CGI. This is real." Technically it's pretty far behind schedule.Only a few months behind flight test milestone in August and a month ahead for financial...http://www.sncspace.com/press_more_info.php?id=361
Quote from: Rocket Science on 07/10/2013 10:40 amQuote from: manboy on 07/10/2013 08:45 amQuote from: Archibald on 07/10/2013 08:00 amWow, didn't realized that project was so advanced in its schedule. Looking at the photo I felt "this is no longer powerpoint or CGI. This is real." Technically it's pretty far behind schedule.Only a few months behind flight test milestone in August and a month ahead for financial...http://www.sncspace.com/press_more_info.php?id=361And the drop test is a year behind schedule.
Tow Test and related overview/status update for Dream Chaser:http://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2013/07/dream-chaser-opening-tow-tests-dryden/
Thanks for pointing out the towing dolly; when I first read about Dream Chaser's nose skid, I wondered how she was going to be towed, and now I know!
Dream Chaser – also known unofficially as “Eagle” – will also end her mission by landing on a runway, although there will be some key differences, especially during the actual touchdown.
The previous picture had the Skid strip on top of a dolly for towing.I wonder if they are going to actually let the skid strip touch the runway for any of these tests, or if they are just testing that the assembly doesn't collapse during the test. How do you fully test the skid strip during these towing tests ?
Quote from: Disco747 on 07/02/2013 03:43 pmThanks for pointing out the towing dolly; when I first read about Dream Chaser's nose skid, I wondered how she was going to be towed, and now I know! So that means that the entire (horizontal/pulling) load of the vehicle when towing is transferred through the skid... interesting!
Quote from: Lar on 07/12/2013 01:58 pmQuote from: Disco747 on 07/02/2013 03:43 pmThanks for pointing out the towing dolly; when I first read about Dream Chaser's nose skid, I wondered how she was going to be towed, and now I know! So that means that the entire (horizontal/pulling) load of the vehicle when towing is transferred through the skid... interesting!maybe - there appears to be three wheels up front and possibly an attachment to the DC body itself (blow up the picture) so maybe we need a better sideways shot??
Quote from: BrightLight on 07/12/2013 02:03 pmQuote from: Lar on 07/12/2013 01:58 pmQuote from: Disco747 on 07/02/2013 03:43 pmThanks for pointing out the towing dolly; when I first read about Dream Chaser's nose skid, I wondered how she was going to be towed, and now I know! So that means that the entire (horizontal/pulling) load of the vehicle when towing is transferred through the skid... interesting!maybe - there appears to be three wheels up front and possibly an attachment to the DC body itself (blow up the picture) so maybe we need a better sideways shot??I think that’s an angle illusion caused by the right rear main gear. I see only two on the dolly... Let's chip in and send Lee Jay there for a photo...
Quote from: Rocket Science on 07/12/2013 02:11 pmQuote from: BrightLight on 07/12/2013 02:03 pmQuote from: Lar on 07/12/2013 01:58 pmQuote from: Disco747 on 07/02/2013 03:43 pmThanks for pointing out the towing dolly; when I first read about Dream Chaser's nose skid, I wondered how she was going to be towed, and now I know! So that means that the entire (horizontal/pulling) load of the vehicle when towing is transferred through the skid... interesting!maybe - there appears to be three wheels up front and possibly an attachment to the DC body itself (blow up the picture) so maybe we need a better sideways shot??I think that’s an angle illusion caused by the right rear main gear. I see only two on the dolly... Let's chip in and send Lee Jay there for a photo... Your probably right on the "third wheel" and ...how much will Lee Jay need?
Quote from: BrightLight on 07/12/2013 02:25 pmQuote from: Rocket Science on 07/12/2013 02:11 pmQuote from: BrightLight on 07/12/2013 02:03 pmQuote from: Lar on 07/12/2013 01:58 pmQuote from: Disco747 on 07/02/2013 03:43 pmThanks for pointing out the towing dolly; when I first read about Dream Chaser's nose skid, I wondered how she was going to be towed, and now I know! So that means that the entire (horizontal/pulling) load of the vehicle when towing is transferred through the skid... interesting!maybe - there appears to be three wheels up front and possibly an attachment to the DC body itself (blow up the picture) so maybe we need a better sideways shot??I think that’s an angle illusion caused by the right rear main gear. I see only two on the dolly... Let's chip in and send Lee Jay there for a photo... Your probably right on the "third wheel" and ...how much will Lee Jay need?I guess we should ask him if he wants to go first...
Quote from: Rocket Science on 07/12/2013 04:10 pmQuote from: BrightLight on 07/12/2013 02:25 pmQuote from: Rocket Science on 07/12/2013 02:11 pmQuote from: BrightLight on 07/12/2013 02:03 pmQuote from: Lar on 07/12/2013 01:58 pmQuote from: Disco747 on 07/02/2013 03:43 pmThanks for pointing out the towing dolly; when I first read about Dream Chaser's nose skid, I wondered how she was going to be towed, and now I know! So that means that the entire (horizontal/pulling) load of the vehicle when towing is transferred through the skid... interesting!maybe - there appears to be three wheels up front and possibly an attachment to the DC body itself (blow up the picture) so maybe we need a better sideways shot??I think that’s an angle illusion caused by the right rear main gear. I see only two on the dolly... Let's chip in and send Lee Jay there for a photo... Your probably right on the "third wheel" and ...how much will Lee Jay need?I guess we should ask him if he wants to go first... Well it's been almost 100F lately in Colorado anyway!
Three photos of tow testing from Kennedy Media Gallery. KSC has the entries dated July 27, 2013 (clearly wrong) - looking at the file number sequence, in comparison other gallery photos, they may be from July 11, 2013 (any exif data in the files has been removed).Shows a bit more detail of the skid structure, which is also supported by a two-wheeled dolly in this sequence.KSC description for last photo:Edwards, Calif. – ED13-0215-072 - Sierra Nevada Corporation SNC Space Systems' team members tow the Dream Chaser flight vehicle along a concrete runway at NASA's Dryden Flight Research Center in California for range and taxi tow tests. The ground testing will validate the performance of the spacecraft's nose skid, brakes, tires and other systems prior to captive-carry and free-flight tests scheduled for later this year.
Three photos of tow testing from Kennedy Media Gallery.
Quote from: AnalogMan on 07/13/2013 12:13 pmThree photos of tow testing from Kennedy Media Gallery.With the amount of what appears to be Duck Tape on that vehicle, I can't see how it could do anything other than fly brilliantly.
Quote from: AnalogMan on 07/13/2013 12:13 pmThree photos of tow testing from Kennedy Media Gallery. KSC has the entries dated July 27, 2013 (clearly wrong) - looking at the file number sequence, in comparison other gallery photos, they may be from July 11, 2013 (any exif data in the files has been removed).Shows a bit more detail of the skid structure, which is also supported by a two-wheeled dolly in this sequence.KSC description for last photo:Edwards, Calif. – ED13-0215-072 - Sierra Nevada Corporation SNC Space Systems' team members tow the Dream Chaser flight vehicle along a concrete runway at NASA's Dryden Flight Research Center in California for range and taxi tow tests. The ground testing will validate the performance of the spacecraft's nose skid, brakes, tires and other systems prior to captive-carry and free-flight tests scheduled for later this year.Note the wool tufts for the aerodynamic tests... Boom makes a convenient place to hang your backpacks. Thanks for posting them!
Note the wool tufts for the aerodynamic tests... Boom makes a convenient place to hang your backpacks. Thanks for posting them!
Quote from: Rocket Science on 07/13/2013 02:31 pmNote the wool tufts for the aerodynamic tests... Boom makes a convenient place to hang your backpacks. Thanks for posting them! LOL. As long as nothing breaks off... then they'd be in trouble!
Do we know how many ETA drop test flights have been planned? I don't recall seeing the specific number of test flights announced previously.
Also posted today (with a few high res photos):http://www.nasa.gov/content/sncs-dream-chaser-rolls-through-ground-tests
Milestone 10a is funded at $5MMilestone 15a is funded at $15M
At this point, I have to ask the unthinkable. What if Dreamchaser crashes during the drop test. Does it mean the Dreamchaser program gets fast tracked to the recycle bin? How would that affect the commercial manned program overall? Would that give ammunition for the foes of commercial spaceflight in congress?
My latest: Dream Chasinghttp://theklydemorrisproject.blogspot.com/2013/08/dream-chasing.html
For better or worse Dreamchaser is the first "physical" commercial manned spacecraft to be tested out of the gate. A lot is riding on this test. It's one thing for SpaceX to have a partial success on a parachute drop test. Meaning possibly a partial chute deploy. It's another for Dreamchaser to come crashing down. For this drop test Dreamchaser will be the posterboy for the whole commercial spaceflight industry. Here's to a successful drop test.
Spacex's cargo vehicle is very different in some ways from the manned version. So really the dragon manned version has not been tested yet physically. Boeing's CST-100 capsule drop test was really just a shell. Dreamchaser will be the first test of an actual, although, partial vehicle.
Quote from: mr. mark on 08/16/2013 06:32 pmSpacex's cargo vehicle is very different in some ways from the manned version. So really the dragon manned version has not been tested yet physically. Boeing's CST-100 capsule drop test was really just a shell. Dreamchaser will be the first test of an actual, although, partial vehicle. I think we all know that. The point is that many systems that will be in common HAVE been tested on orbit, in an actual flying spacecraft. Not a partial/structural test article - even if the shape of this "partial vehicle" is close to the final vehicle.
Quote from: Lars_J on 08/16/2013 06:36 pmQuote from: mr. mark on 08/16/2013 06:32 pmSpacex's cargo vehicle is very different in some ways from the manned version. So really the dragon manned version has not been tested yet physically. Boeing's CST-100 capsule drop test was really just a shell. Dreamchaser will be the first test of an actual, although, partial vehicle. I think we all know that. The point is that many systems that will be in common HAVE been tested on orbit, in an actual flying spacecraft. Not a partial/structural test article - even if the shape of this "partial vehicle" is close to the final vehicle.Understand and point taken. It's true that some of Dragon's manned systems have flown on an actual cargo vehicle to orbit. It will be interesting to see how the race shakes out in 2014 with Spacex's pad abort and inflight abort tests. I have a feeling though that a successful Dreamchaser drop test could go a long way in cementing a top 2 position in the upcoming dowselection. Especially if Boeing or SpaceX appear to lag for whatever reason.
Quote from: mr. mark on 08/16/2013 07:02 pmQuote from: Lars_J on 08/16/2013 06:36 pmQuote from: mr. mark on 08/16/2013 06:32 pmSpacex's cargo vehicle is very different in some ways from the manned version. So really the dragon manned version has not been tested yet physically. Boeing's CST-100 capsule drop test was really just a shell. Dreamchaser will be the first test of an actual, although, partial vehicle. I think we all know that. The point is that many systems that will be in common HAVE been tested on orbit, in an actual flying spacecraft. Not a partial/structural test article - even if the shape of this "partial vehicle" is close to the final vehicle.Understand and point taken. It's true that some of Dragon's manned systems have flown on an actual cargo vehicle to orbit. It will be interesting to see how the race shakes out in 2014 with Spacex's pad abort and inflight abort tests. I have a feeling though that a successful Dreamchaser drop test could go a long way in cementing a top 2 position in the upcoming dowselection. Especially if Boeing or SpaceX appear to lag for whatever reason.I'm not sure it'd cement them ahead of Boeing just because Dreamchaser isn't going to build more airframes and so plans to use this test airframe for the flight vehicle.
Quote from: Robotbeat on 08/16/2013 07:07 pmQuote from: mr. mark on 08/16/2013 07:02 pmQuote from: Lars_J on 08/16/2013 06:36 pmQuote from: mr. mark on 08/16/2013 06:32 pmSpacex's cargo vehicle is very different in some ways from the manned version. So really the dragon manned version has not been tested yet physically. Boeing's CST-100 capsule drop test was really just a shell. Dreamchaser will be the first test of an actual, although, partial vehicle. I think we all know that. The point is that many systems that will be in common HAVE been tested on orbit, in an actual flying spacecraft. Not a partial/structural test article - even if the shape of this "partial vehicle" is close to the final vehicle.Understand and point taken. It's true that some of Dragon's manned systems have flown on an actual cargo vehicle to orbit. It will be interesting to see how the race shakes out in 2014 with Spacex's pad abort and inflight abort tests. I have a feeling though that a successful Dreamchaser drop test could go a long way in cementing a top 2 position in the upcoming dowselection. Especially if Boeing or SpaceX appear to lag for whatever reason.I'm not sure it'd cement them ahead of Boeing just because Dreamchaser isn't going to build more airframes and so plans to use this test airframe for the flight vehicle.I don't believe this actual airframe is going to space. That's the job of the next one. I do believe this ETA is a lot more functional than the aluminum shells used in the capsule drop tests
I'll be very interested when I see an airframe with full TPS and full propulsive capability tested. Then it'll be real!
Quote from: Robotbeat on 08/16/2013 07:42 pmI'll be very interested when I see an airframe with full TPS and full propulsive capability tested. Then it'll be real!Agreed. In the mean time, it will only be awesome.
Best of luck to the DC team. To quote Michael Valentine Smith:Winged bodies are.And thanks to zerm here for a good fifteen minutes of chuckles:Wes has been drawing Klyde Morris since 1978 stopping only to take part in a career as an professional pilot. After 3 different airlines and one corporate operation, he can now state flatly that he has had the privilege of working for 4 of the worst air carriers in the nation. Thus, he went back to cartooning.
Great to see it off the ground.What's the purpose of the trailing parachute ?
Now that Dream Chaser completed two critical milestones this month, I'm looking forward to seeing Dream Chaser make its first free flight this fall.If the Dream Chaser drop test program is successful, then NASA may escalate plans to conduct orbital flight tests of Dream Chaser with the hope that US astronauts will end their two year reliance on the Soyuz spacecraft. I wonder if John Glenn and all the veteran Space Shuttle pilots might live to hop onboard the Dream Chaser.
Do they have a solution for getting higher and/or more speed than the SkyCrane will allow ?
Quote from: Lurker Steve on 08/23/2013 03:11 pmDo they have a solution for getting higher and/or more speed than the SkyCrane will allow ? An Atlas V
Quote from: SaxtonHale on 08/23/2013 03:16 pmQuote from: Lurker Steve on 08/23/2013 03:11 pmDo they have a solution for getting higher and/or more speed than the SkyCrane will allow ? An Atlas V I'm anxious to see that test as well, but I assumed their might be some little baby steps in-between the 12K-15K feet/100 mph and orbital flight.
Quote from: Lurker Steve on 08/23/2013 03:25 pmQuote from: SaxtonHale on 08/23/2013 03:16 pmQuote from: Lurker Steve on 08/23/2013 03:11 pmDo they have a solution for getting higher and/or more speed than the SkyCrane will allow ? An Atlas V I'm anxious to see that test as well, but I assumed their might be some little baby steps in-between the 12K-15K feet/100 mph and orbital flight.There are, but possibly not with the ETA. They have plans for a higher and faster drop with a different lift/tow vehicle, and for powered flight using the hybrids after the drop to accelerate and climb further than that.
Quote from: Lee Jay on 08/23/2013 06:25 pmQuote from: Lurker Steve on 08/23/2013 03:25 pmQuote from: SaxtonHale on 08/23/2013 03:16 pmQuote from: Lurker Steve on 08/23/2013 03:11 pmDo they have a solution for getting higher and/or more speed than the SkyCrane will allow ? An Atlas V I'm anxious to see that test as well, but I assumed their might be some little baby steps in-between the 12K-15K feet/100 mph and orbital flight.There are, but possibly not with the ETA. They have plans for a higher and faster drop with a different lift/tow vehicle, and for powered flight using the hybrids after the drop to accelerate and climb further than that.Good plan, what's the timeline on these tests?
They have plans for a powered flight using the hybrids after the drop to accelerate and climb further than that.
Funny how the X-15 used a nose wheel and this uses a skid. Just interesting...
Quote from: mike robel on 08/29/2013 09:54 pmFunny how the X-15 used a nose wheel and this uses a skid. Just interesting...Pretty interesting I would say... They figured the skids at the rear of the X-15 added stability as well as braking on the dry lake bed. The X-20 was going to use similar skids at the rear with “wire steel brushes” underneath them.Since DC will be landing on paved runways may have been a factor for the wheels on the main gear as on the HL-20
Quote from: Rocket Science on 08/31/2013 01:10 amQuote from: mike robel on 08/29/2013 09:54 pmFunny how the X-15 used a nose wheel and this uses a skid. Just interesting...Pretty interesting I would say... They figured the skids at the rear of the X-15 added stability as well as braking on the dry lake bed. The X-20 was going to use similar skids at the rear with “wire steel brushes” underneath them.Since DC will be landing on paved runways may have been a factor for the wheels on the main gear as on the HL-20Wheels on the main gear allow steering via directional braking, while eliminating nose wheel steering.
Correct, I've mentioned that before a while back on other DC threads as well. http://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=9921.msg878422#msg878422
Quote from: Lurker Steve on 08/16/2013 07:40 pmQuote from: Robotbeat on 08/16/2013 07:07 pmQuote from: mr. mark on 08/16/2013 07:02 pmQuote from: Lars_J on 08/16/2013 06:36 pmQuote from: mr. mark on 08/16/2013 06:32 pmSpacex's cargo vehicle is very different in some ways from the manned version. So really the dragon manned version has not been tested yet physically. Boeing's CST-100 capsule drop test was really just a shell. Dreamchaser will be the first test of an actual, although, partial vehicle. I think we all know that. The point is that many systems that will be in common HAVE been tested on orbit, in an actual flying spacecraft. Not a partial/structural test article - even if the shape of this "partial vehicle" is close to the final vehicle.Understand and point taken. It's true that some of Dragon's manned systems have flown on an actual cargo vehicle to orbit. It will be interesting to see how the race shakes out in 2014 with Spacex's pad abort and inflight abort tests. I have a feeling though that a successful Dreamchaser drop test could go a long way in cementing a top 2 position in the upcoming dowselection. Especially if Boeing or SpaceX appear to lag for whatever reason.I'm not sure it'd cement them ahead of Boeing just because Dreamchaser isn't going to build more airframes and so plans to use this test airframe for the flight vehicle.I don't believe this actual airframe is going to space. That's the job of the next one. I do believe this ETA is a lot more functional than the aluminum shells used in the capsule drop testsMore functional than the ones that went to ISS?I'll be very interested when I see an airframe with full TPS and full propulsive capability tested. Then it'll be real!
They are building another airframe already (the FTA - under construction at MAF by LM) which they plan to fly propulsively and at higher speeds and altitudes, and possibly to orbit.
Quote from: Lee Jay on 09/05/2013 12:49 amThey are building another airframe already (the FTA - under construction at MAF by LM) which they plan to fly propulsively and at higher speeds and altitudes, and possibly to orbit.A Sierra Nevada ship is being built by Lockheed Martin at a NASA Facility?
Any word on when the drop test will be?