Author Topic: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)  (Read 1064571 times)

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1940 on: 11/15/2017 06:43 pm »
Is that HL-20 mockup still at SNC?
AFAIK, maybe LeeJay can confirm...

There's a DreamChaser mockup on display at the Wings Over the Rockies Air & Space Museum. https://wingsmuseum.org/portfolio/dream-chaser/

My google-fu doesn't seem to be able to find where the HL-20 mockup built at LaRC is now.
Nice find, that looks to be her! :)
https://www.nasa.gov/centers/langley/news/factsheets/HL-20.html
« Last Edit: 11/15/2017 06:50 pm by Rocket Science »
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline Ronsmytheiii

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1941 on: 11/15/2017 07:01 pm »
Is that HL-20 mockup still at SNC?
AFAIK, maybe LeeJay can confirm...

There's a DreamChaser mockup on display at the Wings Over the Rockies Air & Space Museum. https://wingsmuseum.org/portfolio/dream-chaser/

My google-fu doesn't seem to be able to find where the HL-20 mockup built at LaRC is now.
Nice find, that looks to be her! :)
https://www.nasa.gov/centers/langley/news/factsheets/HL-20.html

Hey, that belongs at the Virginia Air & Space Center , give it back!

Offline JAFO

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Offline catdlr

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1943 on: 11/16/2017 03:04 am »
SNC released a shorter version of the video.

Dream Chaser Free Flight Test 2017: Shortened

SNCspacesystems
Published on Nov 15, 2017

Sierra Nevada Corporation's (SNC) Dream Chaser® spacecraft had a successful free-flight test on November 11, 2017, at Edwards Air Force Base, with the support of NASA's Armstrong Flight Research Center.



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Offline catdlr

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1944 on: 11/16/2017 03:06 am »
SNC also re-released the original long version.

Dream Chaser Free Flight Test 2017


SNCspacesystems
Published on Nov 15, 2017


Sierra Nevada Corporation's (SNC) Dream Chaser® spacecraft had a successful free-flight test on November 11, 2017, at Edwards Air Force Base, with the support of NASA's Armstrong Flight Research Center.





Tony De La Rosa, ...I'm no Feline Dealer!! I move mountains.  but I'm better known for "I think it's highly sexual." Japanese to English Translation.

Offline penguin44

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1945 on: 11/16/2017 06:41 am »
Left landing gear looks a bit twitchy at 2m01s. Aggressive ABS maybe?

https://twitter.com/sierranevcorp/status/930180794428952576



I thought it was my eyes, but I looked again and saw not only the wheel but the door cover flutter as well.

Offline CameronD

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1946 on: 11/16/2017 09:34 pm »
Amongst the other real photos at https://www.sncorp.com/news-resources/media-resources/, I was amused to see that the "Dream Chaser Cockpit Flight Simulator" pic is merely a wire-frame CAD render of a cockpit simulator with p'shopped Garmin G1000 sim pics dropped in for good measure.  (A simulation of a simulator?) 

The pic is a few years old.. haven't they built a real cockpit simulator yet?
« Last Edit: 11/16/2017 09:40 pm by CameronD »
With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine - however, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are
going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead.

Offline envy887

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1947 on: 11/17/2017 03:08 am »
Amongst the other real photos at https://www.sncorp.com/news-resources/media-resources/, I was amused to see that the "Dream Chaser Cockpit Flight Simulator" pic is merely a wire-frame CAD render of a cockpit simulator with p'shopped Garmin G1000 sim pics dropped in for good measure.  (A simulation of a simulator?) 

The pic is a few years old.. haven't they built a real cockpit simulator yet?

If you're referring to this picture:
https://www.sncorp.com/media/1937/sncs-dream-chaser-cockpit-flight-simulator.png

That's not a render. There are a ton of details that nobody would bother to model or texture, such as crooked cuts in the paneling, 3M tape used to hold the glass panels on, and dirt smudges on the black center panel.

Offline CameronD

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1948 on: 11/17/2017 05:39 am »
Amongst the other real photos at https://www.sncorp.com/news-resources/media-resources/, I was amused to see that the "Dream Chaser Cockpit Flight Simulator" pic is merely a wire-frame CAD render of a cockpit simulator with p'shopped Garmin G1000 sim pics dropped in for good measure.  (A simulation of a simulator?) 

The pic is a few years old.. haven't they built a real cockpit simulator yet?

If you're referring to this picture:
https://www.sncorp.com/media/1937/sncs-dream-chaser-cockpit-flight-simulator.png

That's not a render. There are a ton of details that nobody would bother to model or texture, such as crooked cuts in the paneling, 3M tape used to hold the glass panels on, and dirt smudges on the black center panel.

Ok.. my bad.  Maybe there's not enough resolution on my monitor to pick those fine details up.  :(

..but if it's a real simulator, why the modified G1000 sim views on what are, presumably, touchscreens?  No real software yet??
« Last Edit: 11/17/2017 05:41 am by CameronD »
With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine - however, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are
going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead.

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1949 on: 11/17/2017 03:33 pm »
Amongst the other real photos at https://www.sncorp.com/news-resources/media-resources/, I was amused to see that the "Dream Chaser Cockpit Flight Simulator" pic is merely a wire-frame CAD render of a cockpit simulator with p'shopped Garmin G1000 sim pics dropped in for good measure.  (A simulation of a simulator?) 

The pic is a few years old.. haven't they built a real cockpit simulator yet?

If you're referring to this picture:
https://www.sncorp.com/media/1937/sncs-dream-chaser-cockpit-flight-simulator.png

That's not a render. There are a ton of details that nobody would bother to model or texture, such as crooked cuts in the paneling, 3M tape used to hold the glass panels on, and dirt smudges on the black center panel.

Ok.. my bad.  Maybe there's not enough resolution on my monitor to pick those fine details up.  :(

..but if it's a real simulator, why the modified G1000 sim views on what are, presumably, touchscreens?  No real software yet??
Draper...
http://www.draper.com/news/making-commercial-space-flight-more-accessible
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline penguin44

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1950 on: 11/18/2017 06:59 am »
Yup not a render, you can totally see the side of the photographers head in shadow.

Offline rayleighscatter

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1951 on: 11/18/2017 02:50 pm »
DC trying to thumb a ride from a passing SRB?

Offline Ronsmytheiii

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1952 on: 11/19/2017 11:10 am »
DC trying to thumb a ride from a passing SRB?



That is one of the SRBs that was displayed at KSC with the mockup shuttle Explorer stack at the Visitors center. When that area was redeveloped for The Atlantis building, the California Science Center had the two SRBs from the display (believe they are a mix of real components and mock ups) moved to NASA Armstrong for the eventual full stack Endeavour exhibit. Eventually, Orbital ATK donated a full flight hardware SRB set to the museum, so they are redundant and will stay there for the time being.

Edit: One was donated to the Pima Air and Space Museum in Tucson, Arizona
http://www.collectspace.com/news/news-122916a-pima-air-space-museum-rocket-booster.html
« Last Edit: 11/19/2017 11:23 am by Ronsmytheiii »

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1953 on: 11/19/2017 06:54 pm »
I've been thinking about the final wheels stop position of Dream Chaser since the test. She tracked straight under hard braking with no problems and only veered right at the end of the roll-out. Was this possibly a test to steer clear off an active runway? The claim is that she can land at any airport that can handle a 737... Just musing...
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline CameronD

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1954 on: 11/19/2017 09:28 pm »
I've been thinking about the final wheels stop position of Dream Chaser since the test. She tracked straight under hard braking with no problems and only veered right at the end of the roll-out. Was this possibly a test to steer clear off an active runway? The claim is that she can land at any airport that can handle a 737... Just musing...

If it's related to the apparent left wheel shimmy at all then, just possibly... brake fade.

And it's for this reason I'm not sure you'd want to steer an unpowered vehicle off of a straight line trajectory (eg. onto a taxiway after the landing roll), because, sans nose-wheel, it's not guaranteed that you'd make the turn.
With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine - however, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are
going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead.

Offline adrianwyard

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1955 on: 11/19/2017 09:53 pm »
Both are plausible. I doubt a strong crosswind was a factor this time, but without nose steering could it be somewhat susceptible to getting blown off the centerline as the speed drops?

Offline CameronD

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1956 on: 11/19/2017 10:05 pm »
Both are plausible. I doubt a strong crosswind was a factor this time, but without nose steering could it be somewhat susceptible to getting blown off the centerline as the speed drops?

Potentially.. but at the quoted landing speed of 191 miles per hour, it would need to be a gusty crosswind to have any noticeable effect.

Asymmetric brake fade will be a bigger deal.. because with no brakes on one side, they can't steer at low speed - but no doubt they'll be taking appropriate precautions to prevent that.
With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine - however, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are
going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead.

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1957 on: 11/19/2017 11:25 pm »
I've been thinking about the final wheels stop position of Dream Chaser since the test. She tracked straight under hard braking with no problems and only veered right at the end of the roll-out. Was this possibly a test to steer clear off an active runway? The claim is that she can land at any airport that can handle a 737... Just musing...

If it's related to the apparent left wheel shimmy at all then, just possibly... brake fade.

And it's for this reason I'm not sure you'd want to steer an unpowered vehicle off of a straight line trajectory (eg. onto a taxiway after the landing roll), because, sans nose-wheel, it's not guaranteed that you'd make the turn.
Agreed... I've never landed anything with a nose skid and two wheeled gear so I'm a bit uncertain how it would handle a turn with the drag on the skid and differential braking on one side to turn. Like I said just musing if this was part of the test with their wish to land at airports anywhere and not tie up the runway.  Would be nice to get a definitive answer though...
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

Offline CameronD

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1958 on: 11/20/2017 12:14 am »
I've been thinking about the final wheels stop position of Dream Chaser since the test. She tracked straight under hard braking with no problems and only veered right at the end of the roll-out. Was this possibly a test to steer clear off an active runway? The claim is that she can land at any airport that can handle a 737... Just musing...

If it's related to the apparent left wheel shimmy at all then, just possibly... brake fade.

And it's for this reason I'm not sure you'd want to steer an unpowered vehicle off of a straight line trajectory (eg. onto a taxiway after the landing roll), because, sans nose-wheel, it's not guaranteed that you'd make the turn.
Agreed... I've never landed anything with a nose skid and two wheeled gear so I'm a bit uncertain how it would handle a turn with the drag on the skid and differential braking on one side to turn. Like I said just musing if this was part of the test with their wish to land at airports anywhere and not tie up the runway.  Would be nice to get a definitive answer though...

Sure... From what we've seen it sure seems they would be able to land at any airport that can handle a 737.

Even with a nose skid, they'd need not tie up the runway for more than a couple of minutes if they had their tow vehicle standing by.  Hook on the tow-bar/dolly, brakes off and away they go...in less time than it would take a following aircraft to go around.

This last landing test is impressive on more than a few counts.  :)
 
« Last Edit: 11/20/2017 12:19 am by CameronD »
With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine - however, this is not necessarily a good idea. It is hard to be sure where they are
going to land, and it could be dangerous sitting under them as they fly overhead.

Offline Rocket Science

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Re: Sierra Space Dream Chaser DISCUSSION Thread (was SNC)
« Reply #1959 on: 11/20/2017 01:14 am »
I've been thinking about the final wheels stop position of Dream Chaser since the test. She tracked straight under hard braking with no problems and only veered right at the end of the roll-out. Was this possibly a test to steer clear off an active runway? The claim is that she can land at any airport that can handle a 737... Just musing...

If it's related to the apparent left wheel shimmy at all then, just possibly... brake fade.

And it's for this reason I'm not sure you'd want to steer an unpowered vehicle off of a straight line trajectory (eg. onto a taxiway after the landing roll), because, sans nose-wheel, it's not guaranteed that you'd make the turn.
Agreed... I've never landed anything with a nose skid and two wheeled gear so I'm a bit uncertain how it would handle a turn with the drag on the skid and differential braking on one side to turn. Like I said just musing if this was part of the test with their wish to land at airports anywhere and not tie up the runway.  Would be nice to get a definitive answer though...

Sure... From what we've seen it sure seems they would be able to land at any airport that can handle a 737.

Even with a nose skid, they'd need not tie up the runway for more than a couple of minutes if they had their tow vehicle standing by.  Hook on the tow-bar/dolly, brakes off and away they go...in less time than it would take a following aircraft to go around.

This last landing test is impressive on more than a few counts.  :)
It was well worth the wait to be sure... Note to ground crew "don't forget to wear your oven mitts"... ;D
"The laws of physics are unforgiving"
~Rob: Physics instructor, Aviator

 

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